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10-28-2021, 08:00 AM
#921
Furloughed Again?!
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Boeing 737
Posts: 4,804
Our pay rates for years one through five still trail EVERY other major airline. Whereas captain rates and FO rates after your five follow the curve. The years one through five first officers have every right to be angry and to expect SWAPA to
remedy this in the next CBA. I expected it in 2016 and was disappointed.
remedy this in the next CBA. I expected it in 2016 and was disappointed.
10-28-2021, 08:01 AM
#922
At your mom's house
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: cpt 737
Posts: 2,797
You make it sound like we have monopoly on 0% state income tax. We don't. For example, if you lived in RNO or LAS, would you commute to LAX or SFO to be a captain? The difference is, at a legacy, you'll have to ask yourself that question rather quickly vs. upwards of a decade at Southwest. I'm not even gonna throw in the widebody FO into the mix even though that's what also allows a much faster upgrade there.
I've been labeled "Pollyanna" by many on this board. Where are you Eeyore, SlipKid, Lewbronski, bcz17?
And they're right... Southwest has been very good to me and I have been a bit of a Pollyanna. I live in my domicile and I've been playing "Squid Games" with Scheduling since right after IOE. I've averaged 150-155 TFP monthly my entire time here and I'm a 6th year guy. Do the math. Even when we were overstaffed, I managed to hit those numbers because the game changed and I adjusted. This year, my W-2 will be in the high 200's. One can crush it at Southwest even as an FO, but that comes at a substantial QOL hit.
The point I'm trying to illustrate is that this is not 2008 with abundance of qualified pilots on the street and people both in the military and civilian world chomping at the bit to come here. In fact, when I was hired in 2016, we lost the equivalent of at least 2 full new hire classes to Delta alone. They were hiring quite a bit, United was sputtering a bit unlike today, Fedex hiring a trickle, American wasn't hiring as many either, etc. Not to mention that in 2016, we were in the heated contract negotiations and have 1000+ pilots picketing at various cities. The end result? IIRC, it was 15% raises, but the first year guys got the largest pay raises. We got 35% raise to first year rates, and apparently, it wasn't even SWAPA's request - it was the Company's request. The retention of the new hires got the Company's attention. Here we are, coming into 2022 and retention just might become an even bigger issue.
I've been labeled "Pollyanna" by many on this board. Where are you Eeyore, SlipKid, Lewbronski, bcz17?
And they're right... Southwest has been very good to me and I have been a bit of a Pollyanna. I live in my domicile and I've been playing "Squid Games" with Scheduling since right after IOE. I've averaged 150-155 TFP monthly my entire time here and I'm a 6th year guy. Do the math. Even when we were overstaffed, I managed to hit those numbers because the game changed and I adjusted. This year, my W-2 will be in the high 200's. One can crush it at Southwest even as an FO, but that comes at a substantial QOL hit.The point I'm trying to illustrate is that this is not 2008 with abundance of qualified pilots on the street and people both in the military and civilian world chomping at the bit to come here. In fact, when I was hired in 2016, we lost the equivalent of at least 2 full new hire classes to Delta alone. They were hiring quite a bit, United was sputtering a bit unlike today, Fedex hiring a trickle, American wasn't hiring as many either, etc. Not to mention that in 2016, we were in the heated contract negotiations and have 1000+ pilots picketing at various cities. The end result? IIRC, it was 15% raises, but the first year guys got the largest pay raises. We got 35% raise to first year rates, and apparently, it wasn't even SWAPA's request - it was the Company's request. The retention of the new hires got the Company's attention. Here we are, coming into 2022 and retention just might become an even bigger issue.
I never got the call to one of the others before sw called and I was targeting a specific place to live but now I would seriously consider living another place if I was looking to get hired into a major at this moment.
I had a good opportunity as back then I could move literally anywhere and if I did it again in this industry I would have picked a different airline and place to live.
10-28-2021, 08:20 AM
#924
Furloughed Again?!
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: Boeing 737
Posts: 4,804
10-28-2021, 08:28 AM
#925
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,919
Nope…which is why I haven’t changed my standing bid since day 1. I don’t have LAX anywhere and there’s no ETOPS either.
10-28-2021, 08:31 AM
#926
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,919
You make it sound like we have monopoly on 0% state income tax. We don't. For example, if you lived in RNO or LAS, would you commute to LAX or SFO to be a captain? The difference is, at a legacy, you'll have to ask yourself that question rather quickly vs. upwards of a decade at Southwest. I'm not even gonna throw in the widebody FO into the mix even though that's what also allows a much faster upgrade there.
I've been labeled "Pollyanna" by many on this board. Where are you Eeyore, SlipKid, Lewbronski, bcz17? And they're right... Southwest has been very good to me and I have been a bit of a Pollyanna. I live in my domicile and I've been playing "Squid Games" with Scheduling since right after IOE. I've averaged 150-155 TFP monthly my entire time here and I'm a 6th year guy. Do the math. Even when we were overstaffed, I managed to hit those numbers because the game changed and I adjusted. This year, my W-2 will be in the high 200's. One can crush it at Southwest even as an FO, but that comes at a substantial QOL hit.
The point I'm trying to illustrate is that this is not 2008 with abundance of qualified pilots on the street and people both in the military and civilian world chomping at the bit to come here. In fact, when I was hired in 2016, we lost the equivalent of at least 2 full new hire classes to Delta alone. They were hiring quite a bit, United was sputtering a bit unlike today, Fedex hiring a trickle, American wasn't hiring as many either, etc. Not to mention that in 2016, we were in the heated contract negotiations and have 1000+ pilots picketing at various cities. The end result? IIRC, it was 15% raises, but the first year guys got the largest pay raises. We got 35% raise to first year rates, and apparently, it wasn't even SWAPA's request - it was the Company's request. The retention of the new hires got the Company's attention. Here we are, coming into 2022 and retention just might become an even bigger issue.
I've been labeled "Pollyanna" by many on this board. Where are you Eeyore, SlipKid, Lewbronski, bcz17?
And they're right... Southwest has been very good to me and I have been a bit of a Pollyanna. I live in my domicile and I've been playing "Squid Games" with Scheduling since right after IOE. I've averaged 150-155 TFP monthly my entire time here and I'm a 6th year guy. Do the math. Even when we were overstaffed, I managed to hit those numbers because the game changed and I adjusted. This year, my W-2 will be in the high 200's. One can crush it at Southwest even as an FO, but that comes at a substantial QOL hit.The point I'm trying to illustrate is that this is not 2008 with abundance of qualified pilots on the street and people both in the military and civilian world chomping at the bit to come here. In fact, when I was hired in 2016, we lost the equivalent of at least 2 full new hire classes to Delta alone. They were hiring quite a bit, United was sputtering a bit unlike today, Fedex hiring a trickle, American wasn't hiring as many either, etc. Not to mention that in 2016, we were in the heated contract negotiations and have 1000+ pilots picketing at various cities. The end result? IIRC, it was 15% raises, but the first year guys got the largest pay raises. We got 35% raise to first year rates, and apparently, it wasn't even SWAPA's request - it was the Company's request. The retention of the new hires got the Company's attention. Here we are, coming into 2022 and retention just might become an even bigger issue.
Agree that mgt will have to sweeten the pot for retention and to attract new people. New hire-yr 5 FO pay needs to be brought up to the rest of the industry. Disability, paid medical/parking are needed and don’t cost much.
Curious if you asked any DL/UAL/AA friends how much they’ve made since 2020 and compared it to your numbers?
Compared to my friends, I made way more…but they also sat at home pruning their beards for over a year getting paid guarantee while I was out getting Hindsighted so I guess it depends on which you’d rather do….
10-28-2021, 12:03 PM
#928
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: B737
Posts: 1,204
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