All WARN notices rescinded
01-01-2021, 02:13 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,803
I'm here to get paid as much as possible for working as little as possible. That's my contribution to our culture, now.
The executive VP of redundant VPs can worry about keeping costs low and returning value to the shareholders. It ain't my problem and I don't get paid to do it.
The executive VP of redundant VPs can worry about keeping costs low and returning value to the shareholders. It ain't my problem and I don't get paid to do it.
01-02-2021, 02:10 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2019
Posts: 791
01-02-2021, 10:36 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2012
Posts: 137
Alternative view:
Southwest didn’t furlough any pilots during the worst economic disaster in its history. This despite the fact that the most profitable thing to do, by far, would have been to furlough, deeply, last summer.
Instead, it offered pretty generous early retirement and time off packages, at great cost to the bottom line.
At the end of the day, it treated its employees a lot better than other airlines (and most companies across all industries.)
I’m not saying they didn’t make mistakes, and the idea of threatening furloughs as a bargaining chip to get government aid wasn’t a good look, but the tone of absolute, unforgivable anger here seems, at least to me, pretty extreme.
Southwest didn’t furlough any pilots during the worst economic disaster in its history. This despite the fact that the most profitable thing to do, by far, would have been to furlough, deeply, last summer.
Instead, it offered pretty generous early retirement and time off packages, at great cost to the bottom line.
At the end of the day, it treated its employees a lot better than other airlines (and most companies across all industries.)
I’m not saying they didn’t make mistakes, and the idea of threatening furloughs as a bargaining chip to get government aid wasn’t a good look, but the tone of absolute, unforgivable anger here seems, at least to me, pretty extreme.
01-02-2021, 11:25 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,153
It's a side effect of the type of pilot (personality, etc) SWA has been preferentially hiring for decades. The undercurrent of barely controlled resentment over the "excess" hiring the company did over the last few years is another example of how this manifests and it ties right in to what happened with the 1221 WARN notices. I think the senior guys on the whole are doing a good job not expressing their resentment or holding it against the bottom 15%, but everyone knows that the top 85% took a pay cut and would be able to make more for the same work if the bottom 15% simply weren't on property, without impacting the company's ops or financial bottom line at all. Fortunately very few of the senior guys are resentful enough to actually hold it against the junior guys, but it is kind of uncomfortable as a junior pilot (most of us hired in the last 3 years) knowing that our mere presence represents an "unnecessary" schedule dilution and a pay cut.
Remember, SWA selectively hires people who want to fly MORE. Min guarantee is for suckers and slackers. So hiring people with the idea that they'll go WAY beyond flying their line and then (arguably unnecessarily) hiring more pilots so they CAN'T fly more, is going to cause some angst. Turning around when the company has a fat cash position and expressing clearly conflicting guidance on the urgent need to furlough just triggers even more disbelief. And suddenly all that angst built up over the intentional effort to not blame the junior pilots suddenly has an outlet.
SWA hires people who are biased to fly more.
Our contract rewards this behavior with several ways to get premium pay.
SWA managers HATE premium, and over-hire in addition to implementing wasteful policies to avoid premium flying, reducing the pay of those same eager pilots who thrive on flying more than their line.
Then SWA, sitting on 12Bn in cash, turns around and says they're going to furlough because they HAVE TO, over a measly $220 mil (the 10% pay cut they demanded), which is as blatant a lie as anyone here has ever seen or heard.
Of course there is rage. And of course those junior pilots, grateful to the senior pilots for not treating us like crap, are going to resent the company "leaders" who put us in this situation. It's custom built to encourage pilot group solidarity against what is seen as a direct assault on the pilot group and SWAPA, targeted against the exact personality traits they screened us for in the first place. It's like HR at the direction of our CEO intentionally hired people with a bright red RAGE button on their chest, then hired another group of people to intentionally push that button. It's divisive as hell, and we see it for what it is.
01-02-2021, 11:38 AM
#39
At your mom's house
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: cpt 737
Posts: 2,798
Possibly extreme but I think perfectly understandable if you think about how SWA is set up and who they hire to drive the planes.
It's a side effect of the type of pilot (personality, etc) SWA has been preferentially hiring for decades. The undercurrent of barely controlled resentment over the "excess" hiring the company did over the last few years is another example of how this manifests and it ties right in to what happened with the 1221 WARN notices. I think the senior guys on the whole are doing a good job not expressing their resentment or holding it against the bottom 15%, but everyone knows that the top 85% took a pay cut and would be able to make more for the same work if the bottom 15% simply weren't on property, without impacting the company's ops or financial bottom line at all. Fortunately very few of the senior guys are resentful enough to actually hold it against the junior guys, but it is kind of uncomfortable as a junior pilot (most of us hired in the last 3 years) knowing that our mere presence represents an "unnecessary" schedule dilution and a pay cut.
Remember, SWA selectively hires people who want to fly MORE. Min guarantee is for suckers and slackers. So hiring people with the idea that they'll go WAY beyond flying their line and then (arguably unnecessarily) hiring more pilots so they CAN'T fly more, is going to cause some angst. Turning around when the company has a fat cash position and expressing clearly conflicting guidance on the urgent need to furlough just triggers even more disbelief. And suddenly all that angst built up over the intentional effort to not blame the junior pilots suddenly has an outlet.
SWA hires people who are biased to fly more.
Our contract rewards this behavior with several ways to get premium pay.
SWA managers HATE premium, and over-hire in addition to implementing wasteful policies to avoid premium flying, reducing the pay of those same eager pilots who thrive on flying more than their line.
Then SWA, sitting on 12Bn in cash, turns around and says they're going to furlough because they HAVE TO, over a measly $220 mil (the 10% pay cut they demanded), which is as blatant a lie as anyone here has ever seen or heard.
Of course there is rage. And of course those junior pilots, grateful to the senior pilots for not treating us like crap, are going to resent the company "leaders" who put us in this situation. It's custom built to encourage pilot group solidarity against what is seen as a direct assault on the pilot group and SWAPA, targeted against the exact personality traits they screened us for in the first place. It's like HR at the direction of our CEO intentionally hired people with a bright red RAGE button on their chest, then hired another group of people to intentionally push that button. It's divisive as hell, and we see it for what it is.
It's a side effect of the type of pilot (personality, etc) SWA has been preferentially hiring for decades. The undercurrent of barely controlled resentment over the "excess" hiring the company did over the last few years is another example of how this manifests and it ties right in to what happened with the 1221 WARN notices. I think the senior guys on the whole are doing a good job not expressing their resentment or holding it against the bottom 15%, but everyone knows that the top 85% took a pay cut and would be able to make more for the same work if the bottom 15% simply weren't on property, without impacting the company's ops or financial bottom line at all. Fortunately very few of the senior guys are resentful enough to actually hold it against the junior guys, but it is kind of uncomfortable as a junior pilot (most of us hired in the last 3 years) knowing that our mere presence represents an "unnecessary" schedule dilution and a pay cut.
Remember, SWA selectively hires people who want to fly MORE. Min guarantee is for suckers and slackers. So hiring people with the idea that they'll go WAY beyond flying their line and then (arguably unnecessarily) hiring more pilots so they CAN'T fly more, is going to cause some angst. Turning around when the company has a fat cash position and expressing clearly conflicting guidance on the urgent need to furlough just triggers even more disbelief. And suddenly all that angst built up over the intentional effort to not blame the junior pilots suddenly has an outlet.
SWA hires people who are biased to fly more.
Our contract rewards this behavior with several ways to get premium pay.
SWA managers HATE premium, and over-hire in addition to implementing wasteful policies to avoid premium flying, reducing the pay of those same eager pilots who thrive on flying more than their line.
Then SWA, sitting on 12Bn in cash, turns around and says they're going to furlough because they HAVE TO, over a measly $220 mil (the 10% pay cut they demanded), which is as blatant a lie as anyone here has ever seen or heard.
Of course there is rage. And of course those junior pilots, grateful to the senior pilots for not treating us like crap, are going to resent the company "leaders" who put us in this situation. It's custom built to encourage pilot group solidarity against what is seen as a direct assault on the pilot group and SWAPA, targeted against the exact personality traits they screened us for in the first place. It's like HR at the direction of our CEO intentionally hired people with a bright red RAGE button on their chest, then hired another group of people to intentionally push that button. It's divisive as hell, and we see it for what it is.
Not to mention the undeniable cash crab from the employees to make sure the shareholders, of which the C suite are, come first.
for me that is what drives the extreme frustration in this whole situation. We now all know, if you didnt beforehand, that shareholders are above all and they will do anything they can to make sure they get their bonuses etc.
it's a shame this happened but I'm glad it did because hopefully it woke up people to understand it's all a business and we should treat it that way also.
01-02-2021, 11:44 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 843
They didn't just send furlough notices to get government aid. They sent them to beat out a 10% pay rate concession out of the crews on threat of furlough.
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