hoover

AM or PM you're awake at 0300. This is your career at SW. Company has no intentions ot making commutable schedules or anything human.

Grumpyaviator

AW wants to forge ahead his plans for the company and it’s gonna get way worse for us. He has a vision for SWA and we appreciate that, but he couldn’t care less how it affects the lives of the employees.

WHACKMASTER

Are you referring to red-eyes?

Grumpyaviator

Im referring to the increase of am and pm shoulder flying, JAs, line density, reroutes into extended duty days, etc.

We don’t have the staffing to support the operation organically so scheduling has to use all other measures beyond our awarded schedule to cover flights.

Shoulder operations used to be the exception for unique city pairs, but has now become the norm to increase block hours with limited staffing.

AW says there is no intention to make shoulder flying permanently wide-spread, but there is no plan or timeline for ending it.

Meanwhile, the company has publicly said flying pilots to fatigue means that the system works as it’s supposed to.(told to CNBC by a company spokesman last year in an interview about pilot fatigue).

Cyio

Yeah it is getting pretty nasty on both the am/pm schedules. I am an AM'er and I can tell you that while I love be up early, the 4:05am shows is rough, especially if they happen on day 3 with 4 legs to do. Thankfully AM doesnt get a ton of reroutes and delays, but they are long days which by 1pm , I am pretty much useless. The PM's here is like a prison beating in my opinion. Consistently delayed, often getting you in way past midnight. Just flew with a guy that had his 3 day turn into hell mostly because scheduling had to steal his FO after the first leg to cover some out of base flying. Needless to say they went until 3am that night and 5:15 am the second. My memory of the times may be slightly off, but needless to say it was a brutal experience and he said that situation wasn't uncommon.

I fing I need the days off after our trips as they are so dense. Even four short legs is still four legs.

flensr

SWA safety is on board with this. I had a LONG discussion during annual about this with a safety guy. Bottom line is that according to SWA safety, pushing the operation into the red and then relying on the pilots to sick/fatigue out before they crash the plane is intentional, and anyone questioning it doesn't know what "safety" is.

Cyio

That's pretty scary. They really need a third shift, AM/PM/Crazies lol.

To your point though, this is because people are not calling in fatigued when they should be. My example above is a perfect demonstration of this. If I am not at my last gate by midnight or one I am not fit to fly, I can promise you that and even that is a stretch. Accepting a flight that is going to get you in past three am seems like a foolish thing to do but I guess to each their own.

ZapBrannigan

To be fair, this week’s SWAPA Number podcast discusses fatigue. They acknowledge that relying on pilots to judge their own level of fatigue is problematic. And they also say that if you go at 100% until you know if you fly one more minute you’re going to fall asleep in the seat, you’ve gone way too long.

We have the best fatigue policy in the business. It’s one of the few areas where we truly ARE industry leading. Use it.


(PS - Just had lunch with a friend who was recently turned down for check airman. He said he couldn’t understand why he was turned down because he has over 1200 sick trips. I wanted to kick him in the nards. Don’t come to work sick people!! 🤬 For Pete’s sake!! If they need that kind of loyalty test to become a check airman, then don’t become a check airman. That’s not a choice, it’s an IQ test!)

Grumpyaviator

It’s a totally juvenile, idiotic way to run an operation.

History shows that this attitude, along with the same sense of invisibility and complacency our management has, is what leads to catastrophic accidents.

When we have ours the FAA/NTSB/media will have a field day.

Smooth at FL450

There are plenty of new CKAM...err CKP who have well below the perceived required threshold. One has 83 tfp! Guess those hiring standards have had to come down as well.