Check Complete

Negative! Call in fatigued and stop being used as a pawn. Make management manage, stop being a crutch, and things will get fixed.

rickair7777

You're 100% off base.

The intent is to check reserve coverage to inform the best decision for YOU.

If there are reserves, you might be better off hanging out until they replace you... you get paid, no questions asked.

If there are no reserves, then their only option is to fly you to the outstation and let you time out and RON into your day off. In that case might want to call in fatigued before they board the plane, that's just awkward.

If you call fatigue blindly, you might be leaving money on the table.

Inform yourself, understand their motives and options, have a plan, and know when to execute.

Something else you're wrong about... things will never get fixed. You're living the new normal, SGU has probably concluded that the regional business model as we know it is doomed, and they are just looking to make as much money as they can before the inevitable staffing-induced downsizing.

PhantomHawk

Calling in fatigued because you don’t want to be inconvenienced is a good way to jack up the fatigue system. Be a man and refuse the flight, then face the consequences. Or....be a professional and do your job, accepting that sometimes your schedule gets changed. Calling out fatigued when you’re not fatigued is a b*tch move.

rickair7777

Even if the company is deliberately gaming the system to force you into becoming a reserve on your day off... in violation of the spirit of the policy?

Sometimes you have to fight fire with fire.

But you could call in emergency or sick too, that might better preserve the fatigue system for what it's really intended for. Sick might be best, for emergency they're entitled to a detailed explanation of the circumstances if the ask.

RemoveB4Flight

Negative. This was exactly what the company had been forcing over the summer and SAPA got it cleared up. Days off were determined to be days off (weird right?).
So the determination is if it is delayed and will be a quick turn on your day off (middle of the night) then you still have to do it. If the delay will force you into rest then you are NOT obligated to do the return flight the next day. Since you were released into rest on your day off you do not have to report back to duty that day. You CAN if you choose to (and are legal for it) but it is voluntary.

rickair7777

CS/DX has a work-around for that which is what I've been talking about...

They'll come up with a bogus determination that you'll be legal to make the return flight, therefore they'll force you to go. Usually involves 3-minute taxi times, cruise at .83, or the like.

Once you arrive at the outstation, then they "re-evaluate" the legalities and "realize" you're stuck. Yes you can just rent a car and drive home, but they're accepting that risk on the assumption that it will be easier for you to just work the return flight.

Seen it happen many times. I think they actually look at your home address to make sure it's not convenient for you to just go home rather than RON. When I told them I was going home the last time this happened, they actually told me they didn't see any flights that would get me to my home town that night. I told them, yeah but you stranded me in my parents home town... See Yah!

I know of what I speak. You might fool me once, but rarely twice.

Check Complete

You don't get it. If it's been a jacked up day and now you are waiting hours to finish up a turn that's the last 2 legs of your trip and you know you're going to be fatigued on the final leg back, why not call in preemptively? All the company cares about is completions, that's how they get payed. They don't care about you, me, or the paxs, just the completion.

If you go out on a turn and get to your destination and then call fatigued, just like another poster said, they will send you to a hotel and bring you back out to finish 10 hours later. How do you think the rest of your crew is going to enjoy going to the hotel and coming back out when it might have been their day off and with possibly no clothes if it was a local?

If another crew did that to me, I'd be furious!

That would be the b*tch move!

trip

Yes but in this case he wasn't even close, 15.5 before even departing. They would have had to release him to a hotel or dh home.

rickair7777

Yes, they can only game it if it's close.

In this case he *should* have been able to refuse due to the time out, RON into day off scenario.

The problem is they don't give you the option to refuse. If you do that, and they don't accept it gracefully, then you had damn well better be right about the (nebulous and ever changing) policy or you could be in a world of hurt. Puts you in a tough position. Especially since you'll need to rely on SAPA to back you up.

Flat out refusing to fly without sick/emer/fatigue could get you fired. I'd venture that if you have any previous history, it will get you fired.

Willing to bet your career on something RJ said in conference call last year?

Blackwing

Or...get an effing contract that prohibits this and requires the company to return you to domicile by the end of your RAP.

LIKE EVERY OTHER CARRIER.