Skywest Awarded 34 New 700/900s
08-02-2012, 07:40 PM
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,576
This back and forth between subcontracting pilots is hilarious. All of your companies exist simply because they(you) are lowballers. If we would have agreed to fly these jets for what you're doing, there would be no you. However, we allowed it and F'ed up. That is history and can't/won't be changed. This segment of the industry will be constant churn. But listening to a Mesaba, Eagle, Whisky, etc bash a 9E, Go jet, compass etc. is absurd. You are all the same. Cheap labor always willing to fly the next larger plane(that we stupidly give up) for a minimal amount or in skywest case, the same as the smaller.
We really can not put skywest in the same category as go jets because they pay better then our company does. (If i remember you are former XJ) I know a lot of Mesaba guys are mad at skywest because they came into MSP and pushed a lot of us out but that is not the same as what go jets is doing to the industry.
08-02-2012, 07:42 PM
#72
I have shiny jet syndrome
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: ELACS, FACs and SECs. Who doesn't love 'em?
Posts: 984
I don't have the patience or energy to keep this up tonight, so I'll just end with this. My whole point had nothing to do with business models or outlooks on the industry. It had everything to do with thinking that you are better than other pilots. I hate to burst your ego bubble, but you aren't.
And as far as the "letter" that you refer to, while I do admit that it was probably a mistake on the MEC's part to do what they did, there were 4 players in that scenario and all of them have blame: The DAL and CMR MECs and Delta and Comair management. So yes, the former CMR MEC has to bear some of the responsibility in that unfortunate circumstance.
I'm glad you have it all figured out and everything, and that you were fortunate and lucky enough to move on with no PIC time, though. Good for you. Unfortunately, not everyone always has a winning lotto ticket.
And as far as the "letter" that you refer to, while I do admit that it was probably a mistake on the MEC's part to do what they did, there were 4 players in that scenario and all of them have blame: The DAL and CMR MECs and Delta and Comair management. So yes, the former CMR MEC has to bear some of the responsibility in that unfortunate circumstance.
I'm glad you have it all figured out and everything, and that you were fortunate and lucky enough to move on with no PIC time, though. Good for you. Unfortunately, not everyone always has a winning lotto ticket.
Last edited by RJtrashPilot; 08-02-2012 at 07:54 PM.
08-02-2012, 08:08 PM
#73
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 8,919
I don't have the patience or energy to keep this up tonight, so I'll just end with this. My whole point had nothing to do with business models or outlooks on the industry. It had everything to do with thinking that you are better than other pilots. I hate to burst your ego bubble, but you aren't.
And as far as the "letter" that you refer to, while I do admit that it was probably a mistake on the MEC's part to do what they did, there were 4 players in that scenario and all of them have blame: The DAL and CMR MECs and Delta and Comair management. So yes, the former CMR MEC has to bear some of the responsibility in that unfortunate circumstance.
I'm glad you have it all figured out and everything, and that you were fortunate and lucky enough to move on with no PIC time, though. Good for you. Unfortunately, not everyone always has a winning lotto ticket.
And as far as the "letter" that you refer to, while I do admit that it was probably a mistake on the MEC's part to do what they did, there were 4 players in that scenario and all of them have blame: The DAL and CMR MECs and Delta and Comair management. So yes, the former CMR MEC has to bear some of the responsibility in that unfortunate circumstance.
I'm glad you have it all figured out and everything, and that you were fortunate and lucky enough to move on with no PIC time, though. Good for you. Unfortunately, not everyone always has a winning lotto ticket.
08-02-2012, 08:11 PM
#74
Rollin'
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: AA Airbus
Posts: 829
We really can not put skywest in the same category as go jets because they pay better then our company does. (If i remember you are former XJ) I know a lot of Mesaba guys are mad at skywest because they came into MSP and pushed a lot of us out but that is not the same as what go jets is doing to the industry.
08-02-2012, 08:18 PM
#75
Rollin'
Joined APC: Sep 2008
Position: AA Airbus
Posts: 829
Don't insult Delta. Delta didn't terminate Comair because of a "decade long blood feud." Delta owned Comair and could have shut them down at any point and shuffled the flying across to numerous other regionals. Nothing would have stopped that from happening. And Delta could also have sold off Comair to Pinnacle, forcefully, and said "deal with it." Comair has been eliminated because they are the most senior pilot group in the DCI system to be operating only 44 aircraft, with the oldest and most expensive CRJ fleets, in an environment with gas at $100/barrel. The new Delta TA just accelerated the whole process.
08-02-2012, 09:10 PM
#76
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 2,035
08-03-2012, 04:46 AM
#78
Looking for a laugh
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,099
So now us regional guys who may very well be out of a job soon (I haven't called anyone a scumbag) who are angered by this "realignment" are the ones who should be thankful for all of this when Delta mainline pilots voted away scope from the very beginning? I am confused.
I get my job (and to some degree am happy) because mainline pilots vote away scope for money... I lose my job because the same pilots vote in a new TA which constricts scope... and I should be thankful now for not having a job? I'm not trying to elevate this situation here but what am I (and the rest of my coworkers) to you Delta mainline pilots? Just a cheap hooker you use and chuck aside when you are done getting what you want?
I get my job (and to some degree am happy) because mainline pilots vote away scope for money... I lose my job because the same pilots vote in a new TA which constricts scope... and I should be thankful now for not having a job? I'm not trying to elevate this situation here but what am I (and the rest of my coworkers) to you Delta mainline pilots? Just a cheap hooker you use and chuck aside when you are done getting what you want?
This has nothing to do with hard feelings about strikes, or emotional crap about who is better. This has to do with making money and increasing shareholder value. Everyone complains about past scope sellouts and wants the mainline to recapture it. What did everyone think? That the company would just move the planes and employees over to the mainline? This is the inevitable end result of recapturing scope. What do you think will happen when the next step, sunsetting all regional contracts comes up? Regional flying is an evolutionary dead end.
When the mainlines were furloughing after 9/11 and the regional were growing like gangbusters, did those that gleefully took the jobs have any care for the ones losing theirs? Did they think that it would go on indefinitely, or did they know or even care that this industry is cyclical and a pulldown would eventually happen?
I feel bad for the Comair folks, I do. I have been furloughed from two airlines in my career, it sucks. I learned to be prepared for anything. If you work in this industry, and don't prepare for the worse, you are only setting yourself up for disappointment. And for gosh sake, go read some books about the airlines! This is nothing new. This is history repeating itself. "Flying the Line I, II, III". "Hard Landings." Texas Air International and that scumbag Lorenzo. Educate yourself.
If you got into the airlines without knowing what happened in the past, if all you saw were shiny planes to fly, without seeing the career wreckage littering the field, if you weren't prepared because you failed to plan, then you have no one to blame but yourself. The goal is to work for the company who's name on the paycheck matches the name on the side of the airplane. Not everyone will make it. There is a figurative minefield of crap that lies in the way, and can strike when you are least ready. Even making it to the top is no guarantee of safety and lifelong earning. (There's that history thing again.)
Sors ventus Temerarus.
08-03-2012, 05:51 AM
#79
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Back in school.
Posts: 580
Honestly? The cold hard economic fact is that all regionals are subcontractors. Forget all the PR feelgood crap about partners and stakeholders. Just like building a house, the general contractor, mainline, hires the subs, regionals, to do some of the work. If the sub starts to cost too much, or underperforms, they get replaced.
This has nothing to do with hard feelings about strikes, or emotional crap about who is better. This has to do with making money and increasing shareholder value. Everyone complains about past scope sellouts and wants the mainline to recapture it. What did everyone think? That the company would just move the planes and employees over to the mainline? This is the inevitable end result of recapturing scope. What do you think will happen when the next step, sunsetting all regional contracts comes up? Regional flying is an evolutionary dead end.
When the mainlines were furloughing after 9/11 and the regional were growing like gangbusters, did those that gleefully took the jobs have any care for the ones losing theirs? Did they think that it would go on indefinitely, or did they know or even care that this industry is cyclical and a pulldown would eventually happen?
I feel bad for the Comair folks, I do. I have been furloughed from two airlines in my career, it sucks. I learned to be prepared for anything. If you work in this industry, and don't prepare for the worse, you are only setting yourself up for disappointment. And for gosh sake, go read some books about the airlines! This is nothing new. This is history repeating itself. "Flying the Line I, II, III". "Hard Landings." Texas Air International and that scumbag Lorenzo. Educate yourself.
If you got into the airlines without knowing what happened in the past, if all you saw were shiny planes to fly, without seeing the career wreckage littering the field, if you weren't prepared because you failed to plan, then you have no one to blame but yourself. The goal is to work for the company who's name on the paycheck matches the name on the side of the airplane. Not everyone will make it. There is a figurative minefield of crap that lies in the way, and can strike when you are least ready. Even making it to the top is no guarantee of safety and lifelong earning. (There's that history thing again.)
Sors ventus Temerarus.
This has nothing to do with hard feelings about strikes, or emotional crap about who is better. This has to do with making money and increasing shareholder value. Everyone complains about past scope sellouts and wants the mainline to recapture it. What did everyone think? That the company would just move the planes and employees over to the mainline? This is the inevitable end result of recapturing scope. What do you think will happen when the next step, sunsetting all regional contracts comes up? Regional flying is an evolutionary dead end.
When the mainlines were furloughing after 9/11 and the regional were growing like gangbusters, did those that gleefully took the jobs have any care for the ones losing theirs? Did they think that it would go on indefinitely, or did they know or even care that this industry is cyclical and a pulldown would eventually happen?
I feel bad for the Comair folks, I do. I have been furloughed from two airlines in my career, it sucks. I learned to be prepared for anything. If you work in this industry, and don't prepare for the worse, you are only setting yourself up for disappointment. And for gosh sake, go read some books about the airlines! This is nothing new. This is history repeating itself. "Flying the Line I, II, III". "Hard Landings." Texas Air International and that scumbag Lorenzo. Educate yourself.
If you got into the airlines without knowing what happened in the past, if all you saw were shiny planes to fly, without seeing the career wreckage littering the field, if you weren't prepared because you failed to plan, then you have no one to blame but yourself. The goal is to work for the company who's name on the paycheck matches the name on the side of the airplane. Not everyone will make it. There is a figurative minefield of crap that lies in the way, and can strike when you are least ready. Even making it to the top is no guarantee of safety and lifelong earning. (There's that history thing again.)
Sors ventus Temerarus.
08-03-2012, 07:10 AM
#80
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2008
Posts: 195
August 03, 2012
SkyWest plans to add more than three dozen 76-seat aircraft to its Delta Connection service and remove nearly twice that number of 50-seaters as a nod to Delta Air Lines’ push for higher-capacity aircraft among its regional partners.
SkyWest, the parent company of SkyWest Airlines and ExpressJet Airlines, will take on 34 aircraft—five Bombardier CRJ700s and 29 CRJ900s—and shed 66 of its CRJ200s under an “understanding” reached with Delta. SkyWest will take delivery of the new aircraft between August 2012 and June 2013 for Delta Connection service and remove the CRJ200s between August 2012 and December 2015.
Of the 66 CRJ200s, 41 are Delta-financed aircraft and are scheduled to be returned to Delta without obligation to SkyWest, the Utah-based company says.
Of the 34 larger regional jets that SkyWest is adding to its Delta Connection operations, Delta says 18 will come from Delta regional subsidiary Comair, which is being shut down as of Sept. 29. Comair currently operates 15 CRJ700s and 13 CRJ900s.
The other 16 will come from Pinnacle, Delta says. Pinnacle, which is restructuring under Chapter 11 with Delta financing, operates 16 CRJ900s for Delta that are scheduled to be removed from service between January and May 2013; it also has a long-term deal to continue operating 41 other CRJ900s for Delta.
SkyWest CFO Michael Kraupp tells Aviation Week that SkyWest continues to determine its plans for the new aircraft—whether to take over existing financing, sublease them or pursue other actions.
The deal comes weeks after SkyWest expressed resistance to Delta’s plan to encourage its regional airline partners to end their 50-seat regional jet flying before feeder contracts expire. Kraupp told Aviation Week at the time that such an offer would not be acceptable unless an alternative were provided for the CRJ200s. He now says SkyWest is receptive to the deal because 41 of the 50-seaters belong to Delta and he is confident that SkyWest can place its 25 50-seaters “based on opportunities that we are working.” He says SkyWest will not have to park any of the aircraft.
SkyWest plans to add more than three dozen 76-seat aircraft to its Delta Connection service and remove nearly twice that number of 50-seaters as a nod to Delta Air Lines’ push for higher-capacity aircraft among its regional partners.
SkyWest, the parent company of SkyWest Airlines and ExpressJet Airlines, will take on 34 aircraft—five Bombardier CRJ700s and 29 CRJ900s—and shed 66 of its CRJ200s under an “understanding” reached with Delta. SkyWest will take delivery of the new aircraft between August 2012 and June 2013 for Delta Connection service and remove the CRJ200s between August 2012 and December 2015.
Of the 66 CRJ200s, 41 are Delta-financed aircraft and are scheduled to be returned to Delta without obligation to SkyWest, the Utah-based company says.
Of the 34 larger regional jets that SkyWest is adding to its Delta Connection operations, Delta says 18 will come from Delta regional subsidiary Comair, which is being shut down as of Sept. 29. Comair currently operates 15 CRJ700s and 13 CRJ900s.
The other 16 will come from Pinnacle, Delta says. Pinnacle, which is restructuring under Chapter 11 with Delta financing, operates 16 CRJ900s for Delta that are scheduled to be removed from service between January and May 2013; it also has a long-term deal to continue operating 41 other CRJ900s for Delta.
SkyWest CFO Michael Kraupp tells Aviation Week that SkyWest continues to determine its plans for the new aircraft—whether to take over existing financing, sublease them or pursue other actions.
The deal comes weeks after SkyWest expressed resistance to Delta’s plan to encourage its regional airline partners to end their 50-seat regional jet flying before feeder contracts expire. Kraupp told Aviation Week at the time that such an offer would not be acceptable unless an alternative were provided for the CRJ200s. He now says SkyWest is receptive to the deal because 41 of the 50-seaters belong to Delta and he is confident that SkyWest can place its 25 50-seaters “based on opportunities that we are working.” He says SkyWest will not have to park any of the aircraft.
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