Skywest
10-26-2014, 07:30 AM
#7261
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2013
Posts: 146
Yes I'm saying other regionals benefits are much better than Skywest. That is no secret. You don't have to look any further than XJT. Why do you think INC ins trying to bring their benefits down to our crappy level? 9E has much better insurance and retirement.
There are other factors to consider but saying our pay scales are industry leading is a joke.
There are other factors to consider but saying our pay scales are industry leading is a joke.
It's also a joke how 85% of them sold every FO down the river for nothing (until they upgrade).
10-26-2014, 07:45 AM
#7262
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: Another RJ FO
Posts: 1,272
Yes I'm saying other regionals benefits are much better than Skywest. That is no secret. You don't have to look any further than XJT. Why do you think INC ins trying to bring their benefits down to our crappy level? 9E has much better insurance and retirement.
There are other factors to consider but saying our pay scales are industry leading is a joke.
There are other factors to consider but saying our pay scales are industry leading is a joke.
10-26-2014, 03:21 PM
#7263
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: EMB 145 CPT
Posts: 2,934
Skywest
That's not the case. You guys do it to everyone. Face biter did to gold just a few post ago. So it's lie that it's just me.
What about before the BHO was implemented? What was the 700 rate before that? But even an override is an undercut because your soft time is paid at the 200 rate (vacation, sick, training, etc). Why would you guys vote that deficient pay system in?
I'll be the first to point out that we have things here that really should be changed for the better that won't be, as a result of our labor situation, but I'll also point out unfair attacks by uninformed outsiders.
To you and too many others on this board that automatically draws cries of kool aid drinking.
To you and too many others on this board that automatically draws cries of kool aid drinking.
Unfair attacks by uninformed outsiders was not the case here though.
You do actually have to look further than XJT because XJT is the only one with higher pay. They also have to pay Union dues subtracting from that pay. Comparing Slywest to Endeavor is a joke. Their contract is so bad that they can't get anyone to apply there. FO pay scale tops out at $37. Skywest 2nd year pay is $37.15.
Air Wisconsin, Envoy, and Horizon don't have higher pay and or better retirement/benefits? Our dues are 1.9% and they are 100% tax deductible so the effective dues rate is lower for those that itemize. It's also well worth it in insurance, if that's all you see it as, but it's a lot more. The fact that you see it as a negative says a lot of the coat tail mentality many Skywest pilots have. Your welcome for all the recent things you guys take advantage of like ASAP, FOQA, KCM, CASS, FFDO, etc.
10-26-2014, 03:29 PM
#7264
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Position: Another RJ FO
Posts: 1,272
Air Wisconsin and Horizon don't have higher pay? Our dues are 1.9% and they are 100% tax deductible so the effective dues rate is lower for those that itemize. It's also well worth it in insurance, if that's all you see it as, but it's a lot more. The fact that you see it as a negative says a lot of the coat tail mentality many Skywest pilots have. Your welcome for all the recent things you guys take advantage of like ASAP, FOQA, KCM, CASS, FFDO, etc.
You guys, Endeavor and Eagle all seem to hate ALPA. How can all of you sit there and say "ALPA is screwing us" yet get mad at Skywest pilots for not voting in ALPA. You're basically saying "we hate ALPA but we hate you more for not hating ALPA with us!" I see it as a huge conflict of intestest to have ALPA represent me while their salaries are paid by UA and DL pilots dues. I'd probably vote yes on some kind of regional airline union but I'd never vote yes on ALPA.
10-26-2014, 04:00 PM
#7265
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 178
Now cue Nevets switching to the tired union mantra of ”it's up to the individual MEC”” to excuse for ALPA failures in 3, 2, 1...
10-26-2014, 05:11 PM
#7266
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: It's hot out here.
Posts: 615
Horizon has a higher pay scale but they're such a small wholly owned company that comparing Skywest/Expressjet to Horizon is kind of silly. They only fly for Alaska and only in a small market and only on one airframe. AWAC has about the same payscale as Skywest but again pays union dues so I probably have about the same if not more take home pay. I doubt most FOs make enough money to itemize and take advantage of the deductions. I've never been able to itemize on my taxes so when people say "it's a tax write off!" to me it just goes in one ear and out the other. I can't write it off anyway so I see it as a disadvantage.
You guys, Endeavor and Eagle all seem to hate ALPA. How can all of you sit there and say "ALPA is screwing us" yet get mad at Skywest pilots for not voting in ALPA. You're basically saying "we hate ALPA but we hate you more for not hating ALPA with us!" I see it as a huge conflict of intestest to have ALPA represent me while their salaries are paid by UA and DL pilots dues. I'd probably vote yes on some kind of regional airline union but I'd never vote yes on ALPA.
You guys, Endeavor and Eagle all seem to hate ALPA. How can all of you sit there and say "ALPA is screwing us" yet get mad at Skywest pilots for not voting in ALPA. You're basically saying "we hate ALPA but we hate you more for not hating ALPA with us!" I see it as a huge conflict of intestest to have ALPA represent me while their salaries are paid by UA and DL pilots dues. I'd probably vote yes on some kind of regional airline union but I'd never vote yes on ALPA.
10-26-2014, 05:20 PM
#7267
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,238
^problem is there is no such thing. And until one is inplace and proven, it won't stand a chance at SkyWest...
10-26-2014, 06:52 PM
#7268
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: EMB 145 CPT
Posts: 2,934
Horizon has a higher pay scale but they're such a small wholly owned company that comparing Skywest/Expressjet to Horizon is kind of silly. They only fly for Alaska and only in a small market and only on one airframe. AWAC has about the same payscale as Skywest but again pays union dues so I probably have about the same if not more take home pay. I doubt most FOs make enough money to itemize and take advantage of the deductions. I've never been able to itemize on my taxes so when people say "it's a tax write off!" to me it just goes in one ear and out the other. I can't write it off anyway so I see it as a disadvantage.
You guys, Endeavor and Eagle all seem to hate ALPA. How can all of you sit there and say "ALPA is screwing us" yet get mad at Skywest pilots for not voting in ALPA. You're basically saying "we hate ALPA but we hate you more for not hating ALPA with us!" I see it as a huge conflict of intestest to have ALPA represent me while their salaries are paid by UA and DL pilots dues. I'd probably vote yes on some kind of regional airline union but I'd never vote yes on ALPA.
You guys, Endeavor and Eagle all seem to hate ALPA. How can all of you sit there and say "ALPA is screwing us" yet get mad at Skywest pilots for not voting in ALPA. You're basically saying "we hate ALPA but we hate you more for not hating ALPA with us!" I see it as a huge conflict of intestest to have ALPA represent me while their salaries are paid by UA and DL pilots dues. I'd probably vote yes on some kind of regional airline union but I'd never vote yes on ALPA.
Next, you quoted me before my edit to include envoy. But regardless, if you are going to use pilot group size as your weak excuse, then there are no other pilot groups that are the size of Skywest. In fact, the small size of these pilot groups like awac and horizon only make the comparison worse in your case. When you have 3300 pilots, as opposed to 500, you have economies of scale, more to spread your cost, making the unit price lower, especially when you are talking about comparing two senior pilot groups like awac and horizon whose longevity only exacerbates their unit cost. Regardless, awac, horizon, envoy, and xjt has much better retirement and healthcare. That was my main point, that you are wrong what you say "all" regionals have crappy retirement and health care. I've pointed out that both small and large pilot groups have both of those.
The fact is that it is up to each individual MEC. For example, if the PSA and PDT MECs wouldnt have entertained concessions, the pilots would've never gotten to vote on the deal.
Why do you guys have to coat tail ride everything? Until one is in place, then you'll vote for it? You want to wait for someone else to do it for you AGAIN? Geesh, at least you guys are honest and unapologetic about it.
10-26-2014, 07:51 PM
#7269
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: CRJ
Posts: 249
Ok, first, I never said anything about ALPA. Also, many people, especially if you have any mortgage interest, will itemize. Still, you totally ignore the fact that you coat tail ALL safety initiatives that unions have pushed through. Again, very telling of a pilot group.
Next, you quoted me before my edit to include envoy. But regardless, if you are going to use pilot group size as your weak excuse, then there are no other pilot groups that are the size of Skywest. In fact, the small size of these pilot groups like awac and horizon only make the comparison worse in your case. When you have 3300 pilots, as opposed to 500, you have economies of scale, more to spread your cost, making the unit price lower, especially when you are talking about comparing two senior pilot groups like awac and horizon whose longevity only exacerbates their unit cost. Regardless, awac, horizon, envoy, and xjt has much better retirement and healthcare. That was my main point, that you are wrong what you say "all" regionals have crappy retirement and health care. I've pointed out that both small and large pilot groups have both of those.
The fact is that it is up to each individual MEC. For example, if the PSA and PDT MECs wouldnt have entertained concessions, the pilots would've never gotten to vote on the deal.
Why do you guys have to coat tail ride everything? Until one is in place, then you'll vote for it? You want to wait for someone else to do it for you AGAIN? Geesh, at least you guys are honest and unapologetic about it.
Next, you quoted me before my edit to include envoy. But regardless, if you are going to use pilot group size as your weak excuse, then there are no other pilot groups that are the size of Skywest. In fact, the small size of these pilot groups like awac and horizon only make the comparison worse in your case. When you have 3300 pilots, as opposed to 500, you have economies of scale, more to spread your cost, making the unit price lower, especially when you are talking about comparing two senior pilot groups like awac and horizon whose longevity only exacerbates their unit cost. Regardless, awac, horizon, envoy, and xjt has much better retirement and healthcare. That was my main point, that you are wrong what you say "all" regionals have crappy retirement and health care. I've pointed out that both small and large pilot groups have both of those.
The fact is that it is up to each individual MEC. For example, if the PSA and PDT MECs wouldnt have entertained concessions, the pilots would've never gotten to vote on the deal.
Why do you guys have to coat tail ride everything? Until one is in place, then you'll vote for it? You want to wait for someone else to do it for you AGAIN? Geesh, at least you guys are honest and unapologetic about it.
Why don't you stop speaking about me because you sure don't know me and I'm sick of being included in your generalized statements about my pilot group... I was an ALPO paying dues member until I got FURLOUGHED!! I'm riding no ones coat tails and I'd appreciate it if you'd stop saying I do!!!
10-26-2014, 08:19 PM
#7270
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2013
Position: 175 CA
Posts: 1,544
Love the riding coat tails argument....when was the last time express jet was a financially viable company? Pretty sure you are being sustained by skywest inc.
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