Contract Signers Should be ashamed
10-09-2024, 08:01 AM
#91
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,205
A lot of us remember being asked to pay for training back in the early to mid 90s. Things got quiet, as they always do in this industry, and pilot's lined up. Some of us did not and waited. The thing is it's just another play by management taking advantage and convincing pilots it's justified. It's not! If we stopped selling ourselves out, and each other, it would stop. It won't though. One could go back to B scale of the 90s where AA convinced it pilot's to join on a much lesser scale to get that major airline job. I knew one, joined as an FE, $2000 a month and lived in his parents basement. He still justifies it to this day as do those pesky guys who crossed the picket lines in the 80s.
That's the game, not the player.
Also where are those B scale guys today? Left seat of a 777 on the NAT to CDG?
10-09-2024, 10:24 AM
#92
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2015
Posts: 392
Originally Posted by rickair7777
Also where are those B scale guys today? Left seat of a 777 on the NAT to CDG?
10-09-2024, 04:35 PM
#93
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2022
Position: Clappin' Rip Bombs
Posts: 437
A lot of us remember being asked to pay for training back in the early to mid 90s. Things got quiet, as they always do in this industry, and pilot's lined up. Some of us did not and waited. The thing is it's just another play by management taking advantage and convincing pilots it's justified. It's not! If we stopped selling ourselves out, and each other, it would stop. It won't though. One could go back to B scale of the 90s where AA convinced it pilot's to join on a much lesser scale to get that major airline job. I knew one, joined as an FE, $2000 a month and lived in his parents basement. He still justifies it to this day as do those pesky guys who crossed the picket lines in the 80s.
Anyone that that tells anyone to sign anything that beholdens you to a company for the tune of $80,000 dollars is either a recruiter or a bookie! Just say no!
We share information here much more than the old days but nothings changed. We are mostly unionized but our unions keep selling us out, why?
Anyone that that tells anyone to sign anything that beholdens you to a company for the tune of $80,000 dollars is either a recruiter or a bookie! Just say no!
We share information here much more than the old days but nothings changed. We are mostly unionized but our unions keep selling us out, why?
10-10-2024, 02:38 PM
#95
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Joined APC: May 2022
Position: Clappin' Rip Bombs
Posts: 437
10-14-2024, 01:48 PM
#96
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Joined APC: Sep 2015
Posts: 392
Unions are not self-sustaining. Like anything worthwhile, they take participation and effort to maintain.
Today, 06:30 AM
#97
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2018
Posts: 77
Two years to move on from a Regional to a Major was a short post-COVID blip in the history of Airline hiring that we will probably never see again, at least in our careers. You had max retirements combined with the fact that the Majors cut too many pilots during COVID combined with the unexpected fast rebound in travel. Each Legacy was hiring 2000 a year combined with all the other Majors (to include ULCCs) hiring at max rate. It took all of that to hire 2000 hour TT regional FOs without a degree.
Consider the environment right now. Most of the Majors have stopped hiring with even one furloughing and a couple others on the verge of it. All three Legacies have, or soon will, reduce their 2025 hiring numbers. The Boeing strike is, and it is not even a question anymore, to delay AC delivery further. What do you see that makes you think things are going to get better in the near future?
Look, you can do whatever you want. I couldn’t care less. But if somebody asks me for my advice, it would be that if you have a class date with a Regional right now and sign a 5-year contract you are much more likely to get to your forever job before somebody who doesn’t. The only CAVEAT would be if that somebody has a sweet Part 91/135 job lined up where they would get some quality TPIC time eventually. Or somebody who has Military flying time.
Consider the environment right now. Most of the Majors have stopped hiring with even one furloughing and a couple others on the verge of it. All three Legacies have, or soon will, reduce their 2025 hiring numbers. The Boeing strike is, and it is not even a question anymore, to delay AC delivery further. What do you see that makes you think things are going to get better in the near future?
Look, you can do whatever you want. I couldn’t care less. But if somebody asks me for my advice, it would be that if you have a class date with a Regional right now and sign a 5-year contract you are much more likely to get to your forever job before somebody who doesn’t. The only CAVEAT would be if that somebody has a sweet Part 91/135 job lined up where they would get some quality TPIC time eventually. Or somebody who has Military flying time.
even with reduced hiring, retirements and demographics mean a long term shortage - those underlying market realities ain't changing
and failing airlines create opportunities for others to step in - the customers flying those failing airlines will still be traveling
and we have had several new airlines start up who have hired pilots
and yes, since "none of us know what is going to happen" why saddle oneself with a yuuuuge financial burden -- esp one that, even without that burden, is the toughest regional to jump to the big three from anyway because the big three don't want to hurt their regional lift?
the seniority diff between Jan '23 and Oct '24 at ual is >3000 pilots - WITH the doom and gloom you've stated ... they're hiring isn't slowing in 2025 either, and aa has like 1,000/year out due to age
being stuck at a regional an extra year or three isn't just $80k one doesn't have, it could be decades of making less, commuting or having a worse qol
but if skw is your forever (it's not a bad place to work as regionals go), go for it and be happy
Today, 05:17 PM
#98
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Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 892
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