After UPS crash, former NTSB chairman says pl
08-18-2013, 01:22 PM
#82
With The Resistance
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
They fly on the back side of the clock too, but you already knew that, just as you know FDX/UPS do much of their flying on the backside of the clock.
Actual hours flown per month/year might make for a more interesting comparison between pax/cargo.
Actual hours flown per month/year might make for a more interesting comparison between pax/cargo.
08-19-2013, 12:51 PM
#83
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: MD-11 F/O
Posts: 244
I never flew 4 legs on the back side of the clock. The most was two, and that was changed after enough complaints from crews. The norm pax is one leg international, and with a relief pilot. I never flew 4 legs on the back side of the clock with a two man crew, as happens with night domestic cargo.
08-19-2013, 12:57 PM
#84
With The Resistance
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
I never flew 4 legs on the back side of the clock. The most was two, and that was changed after enough complaints from crews. The norm pax is one leg international, and with a relief pilot. I never flew 4 legs on the back side of the clock with a two man crew, as happens with night domestic cargo.
Lots of domestic pax guys doing four legs, just different hours.
Sunshine seems to be the main difference.
08-19-2013, 01:28 PM
#85
Banned
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 798
I am surprised. While I don't always agree with you, you always seem to put a great deal of effort into grooming the appearance of being a vastly superior intellect on this board. You didn't even bother this time.
Pipe
08-19-2013, 01:33 PM
#86
With The Resistance
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
Yes - sunshine and circadian rhythm disruptions, closed towers, stale weather reports, runways and taxiways poorly or not cleared, lack of pilot reports, cumulative fatigue effects, equally tired controllers, lack of visual cues, and runways and approach aids closed for maintenance overnight, just to name a few more that come to mind.
I am surprised. While I don't always agree with you, you always seem to put a great deal of effort into grooming the appearance of being a vastly superior intellect on this board. You didn't even bother this time.
Pipe
I am surprised. While I don't always agree with you, you always seem to put a great deal of effort into grooming the appearance of being a vastly superior intellect on this board. You didn't even bother this time.
Pipe
It doesn't take much effort, but it is harder than being a parrot.
What we have learned so far is that some people signed on for a job flying cargo at night and now they have developed a case of buyer's remorse.
08-19-2013, 04:20 PM
#87
Banned
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 798
Thanks, I can well understand that common sense might seem a vastly superior intellect these days.
It doesn't take much effort, but it is harder than being a parrot.
What we have learned so far is that some people signed on for a job flying cargo at night and now they have developed a case of buyer's remorse.
It doesn't take much effort, but it is harder than being a parrot.
What we have learned so far is that some people signed on for a job flying cargo at night and now they have developed a case of buyer's remorse.
Why have TCAS, you knew there was other traffic out there.
We don't need GPWS, that terrain was there when you put in your application.
When you accepted a position in this industry did you assume that a freeze would be placed on all safety initiatives as of that date?
The rest rules were derived from scientific data. The FAA then buckled to political pressure and made a deliberate decision to ignore the facts that they themselves had amassed.
Your infer that pilots demanding that factual data not be ignored and safety not be a political football is whining. To quote John McEnroe, "You CANNOT be serious!"
Pipe
08-19-2013, 04:40 PM
#88
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: MD-11 F/O
Posts: 244
Don't be fooled by verbal gymnastics. Hemingway proved that verbal intelligence didn't require overly verbose prose.
08-19-2013, 05:15 PM
#89
With The Resistance
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
To extrapolate on your line of reasoning:
Why have TCAS, you knew there was other traffic out there.
We don't need GPWS, that terrain was there when you put in your application.
When you accepted a position in this industry did you assume that a freeze would be placed on all safety initiatives as of that date?
The rest rules were derived from scientific data. The FAA then buckled to political pressure and made a deliberate decision to ignore the facts that they themselves had amassed.
Your infer that pilots demanding that factual data not be ignored and safety not be a political football is whining. To quote John McEnroe, "You CANNOT be serious!"
Pipe
Why have TCAS, you knew there was other traffic out there.
We don't need GPWS, that terrain was there when you put in your application.
When you accepted a position in this industry did you assume that a freeze would be placed on all safety initiatives as of that date?
The rest rules were derived from scientific data. The FAA then buckled to political pressure and made a deliberate decision to ignore the facts that they themselves had amassed.
Your infer that pilots demanding that factual data not be ignored and safety not be a political football is whining. To quote John McEnroe, "You CANNOT be serious!"
Pipe
We have seen changes over time, but we have both been a political football.
You think the same people who gave you the carve out are going to fix it, and that may eventually happen, but my position is to adapt and deal with it for the many years that may take. I am more concerned about actions to take now to preserve your well-being than reliance on something that may never happen in the distant future.
Time spent improving your own response may be better than misplaced faith in distant future outcomes from a survival viewpoint.
Waiting for someone or some group to fix your problems is a poor tactic when faced with an immediate threat.
08-19-2013, 05:48 PM
#90
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: MD-11 F/O
Posts: 244
I am more concerned about actions to take now to preserve your well-being than reliance on something that may never happen in the distant future.
Time spent improving your own response may be better than misplaced faith in distant future outcomes from a survival viewpoint.
Waiting for someone or some group to fix your problems is a poor tactic when faced with an immediate threat.
Time spent improving your own response may be better than misplaced faith in distant future outcomes from a survival viewpoint.
Waiting for someone or some group to fix your problems is a poor tactic when faced with an immediate threat.
Agreed. If you need to call in fatigued, don't fear your employer. Fly safe and be professional. Protect yourself and your family.
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