C-172 hits car at 52F (Roanoke, TX)
11-06-2012, 06:07 AM
#31
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Joined APC: Nov 2011
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Yeahbut...he was operating into an airport where he KNEW there is a roadway right at the end of the runway. I will ass-u-me this was not the first time this student pilot has been there as he had his wife videoing it. Was it his home field? If it was, even less of an excuse, for not checking the roadway for trafic prior to crossing the 'fence'.
Oh, and he was very low, obviously, or none of this would have happened.
Now, the tools in the car also should have at least stopped and taken a look in that diretion, so they are both (pilot and driver) guilty of not checking for the most obvious threat.
Oh, and he was very low, obviously, or none of this would have happened.
Now, the tools in the car also should have at least stopped and taken a look in that diretion, so they are both (pilot and driver) guilty of not checking for the most obvious threat.
11-06-2012, 07:12 AM
#32
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jan 2012
Posts: 93
I didn't see the landing light on either.....Its the pilots fault the car was hit. I don't agree with the pilot giving up flying, but he does need a lot more training. I know we have all done some dumb things as a solo student, but landing on the displaced threshold with a road that close shouldn't have happened....the wind was calm if you want to practice short field landings why not use the opposite end?
Last edited by prwest; 11-06-2012 at 07:52 AM.
11-06-2012, 07:17 AM
#33
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Imagine how people drive on the roads- now put them at a country non-towered airport and turn them loose.
11-06-2012, 07:26 AM
#34
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,020
Yes, the airplane has the right-away, that's why the car had a stop sign (and the airplane did not).
I write this off to bad airport management...the stop signs are not obvious, they are painted on the road. I'm sure they did this to avoid vertical protrusions in the clearway but what they should have done was had large, red or yellow signs further out advising drivers to look and for and yield to aircraft. I've seen signs like that at other airports, and that would probably get their attention better than a generic stop sign which doesn't prompt their little proto-brains to think about looking up in the sky for traffic.
I wouldn't blame a student pilot...he was busy and task-focused (and may have been practicing short-field LDGs). We commonly drill airspeed and RWY alignment into students...not check 3 and 9 for SUVs.
11-06-2012, 01:18 PM
#35
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
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Maybe, but in the end it may be unrealistic to expect that a pilot can divide his attention like that on VERY short final. The closer he gets, the closer he is concentrating on one thing. Add in some other aeronautical factors, and again, it may be unrealistic to expect training/awareness will solve the problem. Would it be "zero" changes of happening again? It would be a much better solution to move the road, ensure cars can not travel on it when aircraft are in the area, displace the threshold and pavement, etc. The best human factors solutions are the ones that eliminate the possibility of human error, because the human system is prone to fault, no matter how good we want it to be. This is isn't to say "remove the pilot", but "remove the problem". Always the best option if feasible.
He should have been constantly checking that road while he was on downwind, base and then again on final...oh, and he shouldn't have been so low across the fence, as if he didn't hit the car, he would've landed well short of the runway.
What if instead of a car, it was a UPS delivery truck...
I agree the road needs to be moved, or closed or have a blinking red light or something, it looked to me like their 'fix' was to displace the runway threshold, but the student pilot was simply too low. I would like to ask his instructor if he had a (bad) habbit of doing this, coming in low, or if this was just a one-time oopsy.
As I told them in the Air Force, "If you want to eliminate Human Errors, first you need to eliminate Humans."
With the UAV's, they sure are trying!
11-06-2012, 01:55 PM
#36
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Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
Airport Reviews Safety Measures After Plane Clips SUV « CBS Dallas / Fort Worth
Article mentions some of the safety factors and measures already in place or soon to come.
USMCFLYR
Article mentions some of the safety factors and measures already in place or soon to come.
USMCFLYR
Last edited by USMCFLYR; 11-06-2012 at 04:39 PM.
11-06-2012, 03:46 PM
#37
Eats shoots and leaves...
Joined APC: Apr 2007
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11-06-2012, 04:52 PM
#38
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Aircraft always have the right of way. Always. You can stop your vehicle at anytime. I don't know of any aircraft that can simply stop in midair to allow a vehicle to pass in front of it.
If I didn't yield to an aircraft at work, I'd lose my job, instantly.
If I didn't yield to an aircraft at work, I'd lose my job, instantly.
11-06-2012, 04:58 PM
#39
Eats shoots and leaves...
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: Didactic Synthetic Aviation Experience Provider
Posts: 849
Rotorcraft can.
But yes, I agree - aircraft do have the right of way.
One report I heard stated that the road was privately owned and NOT under the control of the airport. Give the apparently poor markings of the "crossing," that sounds like a liability for whoever owns/controls the road!
11-07-2012, 08:07 PM
#40
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Posts: 406
I'm not convinced that the driver should have much, if any of the blame. To those that know this airport, is it possible that the driver didn't know that the runway was so close? As for the painted Stop sign on the road; On public roads and parking lots, they are not considered to be traffic control devices. i.e. A cop could not issue a citation for running stop markings painted on the road if there is no sign.
I think that the blame is more to the pilot and poor signage.
I think that the blame is more to the pilot and poor signage.
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