stillcantfly

Whoops great Catch almost forgot about them

Captainobvious

It shows you are not from Endeavor... Nothing you said is true, although it is somewhat close to true.

1. Payscales did NOT go up 22/hour. But there are almost 3 years remaining on a 20,000/year retention bonus (about 12,000/year after taxes)

2. The only payscale that did increase was year 1 scale (up to I believe 30/hour)

3. There are NO GUARANTEED SLOTS at Delta, and there is NO FLOW EITHER. There is a guaranteed interview in which about half are told yes and half are told no, and among those told yes, they have to wait for a slot at delta to open up (they limit the amount of our pilots they take to about 180 per year maximum (sometimes less depending upon their hiring)

I know this because I do work for Endeavor (8 year First officer) and am looking at a possible lateral move as well. Although the STARTING pay here is great compared to most regionals the career progression program is horrible. Those who are told "no" at the interview come back to endeavor to fly delta's passengers and seem to be highly discouraged. When the interview success rate is 60% and rejection rate 40% it make the morale of 40% of the employees very very low, hence the morale issues here at endeavor and the reason I'm looking to possibly move on. I wont tell you to not go to Endeavor, but I also wont tell you to come here either. I think there are pro's and con's to this company. If they fix the con's it will be a great regional carrier, but unless that point comes carefully consider the pluses and minuses. That would be my advise.

Best of luck to you!

Captain O.

404yxl

Re-read what I said. I said the payscales all went up $22K/yr, not $22/hour. Everyone gets the basic retention bonus on top of their pay, which means everyone saw their annual pay go up by that amount. Your basic pay over your first 3 years at Endeavor will be ~$150,000 vs. ~$110,000 at Compass as an FO. That is due to everyone, regardless of longevity seeing the retention bonus vs. only raising 1st year pay.

For someone that works at Endeavor, you should know this. Also, as an 8 year FO, your experience, just like mine and many others, is not the experience that new hires in this industry will experience. We experienced a severe economic downturn and age 65. This set us all back 5-10 years. Unless they experience something similar, there experience won't mimic ours.

As for not having a flow, once the pilots pass the SSP, they are effectively flow pilots. When one looks at a regional, it is a good idea to take into the guaranteed flow pilots that already exist. This is what made Compass so appealing in 2013-2015, and is why Endeavor is a good option now.

Nantonaku

A strange statement to make, first, you don't know what each individual's tax rate might be (if they have a spouse making enough the yearly bonus might be 8,000 after taxes). Secondly, stating it this way would be like everyone going around saying they make $60,000 a year but then putting in parenthesis, after taxes I only get $30,000. It shows your lack of understanding of tax code and would make me question taking any advice you are giving.

Furthermore, after putting in 8 years at 9E and being literally months away from upgrade and then even considering GoJet to me shows that you are blinded by something other than logic and rational thought. If I were you I would step away and take a few deep breaths and pull yourself together before you do something you know you are going to regret.

404yxl

Makes no sense. Either he is not a Endeavor pilot, or is setting himself up for another hurt somewhere else, especially if they shrink due to issues staffing over there all while Endeavor is going through a high attrition and growth phase.

He literally will see hundreds above him flow to Delta and his seniority % gain far quicker than he has experienced before in his career and now he wants to leave Endeavor? If he wanted to make a smart lateral move, he should have gone to Compass between mid-2013 to late-2014.

Captainobvious

1. Pay scale implies hourly pay rate. The hourly payrate for year one is 30/hour. that's a fact. Bonuses are not a part of a payscale. The $20,000/year bonuse last for 3 more years.

2. I dont speculate on the future of peoples career. period. The reason is because I was told when I was hired that I'd be a captain in 2-3 years. Expectations don't always come through, but then again sometimes expectations do come through.

3. in no way, shape, or form do we have a "flow". to say once someone completes their "DGI" or "SSP" they essentially become a "flow pilot" and then comparing that to the actual flow that Compass has is both a misconceived concept and dishonest. IF someone passes their SSP/DGI (which on average over 40% do not) then they may go to Delta when/if Delta gives them a class date (typically years later).

Are you and the other 2 responders to my post Endeavor recruiters by chance?

Nantonaku

Sure, we are Endeavor recruiters. Do this for all of us here, go to GoJet and give us monthly updates.

Captainobvious

Bonus tax rate = 25% (may get a little back depending upon your tax bracket)
SS withholding (employee) = 7.5%
Alpa withholding = 2%
State tax rate = (varies but based upon our bases probably around 5-8%)

Grand total = Approximately 40%

Finding out that some people would rather play semantics with your words rather than understanding the grand scheme of what you're saying = Priceless

20,000 * .6 = 12,000/year

and for the benefit Nantonaku this number is an estimate since it is improbable for me or any other APC poster to know the tax bracket/state taxes/status of every airline pilot and their spouses income at Endeavor. Is this clear enough for you? Oh and before you play more semantics, yes I know ALPA withholding is 1.95% not 2%. Just in case you want to label me as having no knowledge of the union that represents me as well (and therefore know nothing else and cant be trusted) as you so insinuated due to my lack of knowledge of tax code. Oh and also by the way, the tax code is over 80,000 pages long, so in a way you're right, I am ignorant of the vast majority of tax codes. But then again I'm an airline pilot, not a tax professional.

404yxl

Now you are pulling teeth. It seems like you just want to ignore what the $22K/yr retention does. Did I say hourly rate?

It's part of the pilots pay, plain and simple. It is a direct $22K/yr increase in their salary, every year. Simple.

Your experience means nothing to what the new hires will see. You went through an economic downturn and age 65. Without that take 5-10 years off what you saw.

When did I say Endeavor had a flow. Wow, just go back and read that the pilots who PASSED the SSP are effectively flow pilots, which is true.

You seem jaded to the fact you are ignoring Endeavor's true situation. I have no ties to Endeavor mind you

You don't seem to understand taxes. Even if the IRS withheld 100%, it would still be rectified when you did your taxes. The retro pay is taxed the same as you regular pay in the end.

Captainobvious

Well, in that case, stretching and curbing the truth on APC to make the company you represent, as a pilot recruiter, sound better to new hires than it actually is just so that you can meet your hiring number goals each month is both dishonest and disheartening. So regardless IF I choose to move on or stay here, it will be a decision based upon many factors, but it will not be based upon the frustrated response of an admitted pilot recruiter who doesn't like that fact that I exposed (with truth and honesty) the lies used to further their goal. But anyway no hard feelings and best of luck to you!

Captain O