Republic Pilots (IBT) Request NMB Release
07-14-2012, 10:31 AM
#101
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: doggy style
Posts: 1,006
...ummmm...yes that is struck work. It doesnt matter who "gets the money". Smart thinking though on not flying it....cause it wont be worth it. Modern flight tracking makes spotting scab work easier now days...and with connections at other airlines, itd be easy to get the names of who flew what.
United flies an AVERAGE of an Airbus (mainline), 2 E170s(Republic) and an E145 (XJET) between ORD and ATL. This changes daily and month to month.
Who's to say if Republic strikes, United replaces those 2 E170s with an Airbus. Are those mainline pilots scabs? What about if they replace them with 2 E145s flown by XJET? Are those guys scabs? What's the difference?
07-14-2012, 10:52 AM
#102
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2010
Position: A320 Captain
Posts: 641
The UAL pilots, Frontier pilots etc. are not scabs at all. Different CBA's. If I was covering a flight that CHQ flew for UAL, then yes that would be considered struck work. If I fly a trip that RAH flies for F9 and if we fly it as well with an Airbus then I would not consider that struck work as well. Do you think that UAL pilots or any other of the legacies that you fly for are not going to fly those trips that you do not fly on their behalf?
07-14-2012, 11:08 AM
#103
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: doggy style
Posts: 1,006
The UAL pilots, Frontier pilots etc. are not scabs at all. Different CBA's. If I was covering a flight that CHQ flew for UAL, then yes that would be considered struck work. If I fly a trip that RAH flies for F9 and if we fly it as well with an Airbus then I would not consider that struck work as well. Do you think that UAL pilots or any other of the legacies that you fly for are not going to fly those trips that you do not fly on their behalf?
For one, I would never know the difference if I was flying a flight that was once Republic's.
Second, if I did know the difference, I cannot/ will not refuse it. The goal is not to punish United, it is to punish Republic management. The very fact that they won't make any money by us flying that leg, means it is not struck work. If United tells us to fly it, we have to.
Now, IF Republic management called up XJET management and said, "hey, we got this flying that needs to be covered and we'll go splitsies on the $$." Then, yes, that would be struck work and I would have basis to refuse it.
07-14-2012, 12:04 PM
#104
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2008
Position: ERJ-170
Posts: 139
If there is a strike (big if) it will last days or maybe a week or two. After that RAH would be bankrupt. Flight schedules are published way outside this type of time frame. Very easy to see who is scheduled to operate the ORD-SDF 1030am departure on Aug. 15. The union will look for any change of frequency or gauge to determine what is struck work.
07-14-2012, 12:06 PM
#105
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2012
Position: FO
Posts: 101
I like the way you think, you should apply to Seabury.
For 50k, I'll out myself, go to work and 2 months later hire an attorney to pursue a hostile work environment lawsuit and retire!
Everyone's happy!
07-14-2012, 12:32 PM
#106
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 339
The UAL pilots, Frontier pilots etc. are not scabs at all. Different CBA's. If I was covering a flight that CHQ flew for UAL, then yes that would be considered struck work. If I fly a trip that RAH flies for F9 and if we fly it as well with an Airbus then I would not consider that struck work as well. Do you think that UAL pilots or any other of the legacies that you fly for are not going to fly those trips that you do not fly on their behalf?
The USairways flying between LGA and DCA is flown exclusively by USairways, it is not struck work.
The USairways flying between MHT and DCA is mostly RAH, with a mix of Wisconsin and PSA. The departure flight times operated RAH is struck work. The departure flight times operated by AWI and PSA is not struck work.
07-14-2012, 12:48 PM
#107
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2012
Posts: 339
Your mainline partners probably already have a plan for those flights anyway. It is not your flying anyways. It is USAiRS/Delta flying. It is not RAH flying. You guys will be the next comair. Your only leverage is to hurt your companies pocket book. That is it. Mainline can and will replace that flying. It could be a RJ or a airbus.
07-14-2012, 01:11 PM
#108
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2009
Posts: 643
Wow, 11 pages of nuance regarding a strike that will never happen.
I truly feel for the guys flying the line at RAH, you deserve a better CBA. When all is said and done, your group will probably set a record for years between amendable date and ratification. That is not something to be proud of.
I can't believe there is not more of an uproar from the rank and file demanding more action. I read the PDU's and Negotiating committee updates and they sound like a High School student council debate. Childish name calling will get you nothing, and nothing is what you currently have.
Your Union let you believe that you would have a new CBA by last Christmas. Remember all of the excitement back when they were interviewed by the Local press in November 2011?
Your Union is still letting you believe that you will acheive something close to JBLU 190 rates.
Your Union is still letting you believe that they have some ace up their sleeve and you will be released to strike.
Your Union is still letting you believe that the result of a strike will be the CBA of your dreams.
I wish you all the best, I really do. I have participated in more than one CPA Section 6 negotiation. They are not fun.
The combination of poor performance by your leadership and the unrealistic expectations of the rank and file is a recipe for total disaster.
What happens if you do get your strike, and your TA, but it falls short of 99% of everyone's "wants"?
Your "11th hour" deal may be extremely similar to the deal currently on the table. What are you going to do then?
Recall your current leadership while working under yet another inferior CBA for another decade?
I would be asking everyone at the IBT Airline Division why Negotiations were halted completely for years. Meanwhile, during that unnecessary delay virtually every 50 seat operator has signed a concessionary deal or is standing on the precipices of BK. You have effectively delayed yourselves into the worst economic environment in aviation history to be negotiating rates for small RJ's. Where is the outrage from the rank and file?
Those of us looking on from the sidelines are scratching our heads, asking why you haven't done more for yourselves by now. This October will mark five year of nothing. I know all about BB and Henson and Hellar and how they are the bad guys. Do you honestly think that every other airline has "nicer" leadership? Somehow every other airline, regional, LCC, legacy, can somehow achieve an Agreement while you guys march towards 5 years since your amendable date.
I feel bad for you. You deserve better.
I truly feel for the guys flying the line at RAH, you deserve a better CBA. When all is said and done, your group will probably set a record for years between amendable date and ratification. That is not something to be proud of.
I can't believe there is not more of an uproar from the rank and file demanding more action. I read the PDU's and Negotiating committee updates and they sound like a High School student council debate. Childish name calling will get you nothing, and nothing is what you currently have.
Your Union let you believe that you would have a new CBA by last Christmas. Remember all of the excitement back when they were interviewed by the Local press in November 2011?
Your Union is still letting you believe that you will acheive something close to JBLU 190 rates.
Your Union is still letting you believe that they have some ace up their sleeve and you will be released to strike.
Your Union is still letting you believe that the result of a strike will be the CBA of your dreams.
I wish you all the best, I really do. I have participated in more than one CPA Section 6 negotiation. They are not fun.
The combination of poor performance by your leadership and the unrealistic expectations of the rank and file is a recipe for total disaster.
What happens if you do get your strike, and your TA, but it falls short of 99% of everyone's "wants"?
Your "11th hour" deal may be extremely similar to the deal currently on the table. What are you going to do then?
Recall your current leadership while working under yet another inferior CBA for another decade?
I would be asking everyone at the IBT Airline Division why Negotiations were halted completely for years. Meanwhile, during that unnecessary delay virtually every 50 seat operator has signed a concessionary deal or is standing on the precipices of BK. You have effectively delayed yourselves into the worst economic environment in aviation history to be negotiating rates for small RJ's. Where is the outrage from the rank and file?
Those of us looking on from the sidelines are scratching our heads, asking why you haven't done more for yourselves by now. This October will mark five year of nothing. I know all about BB and Henson and Hellar and how they are the bad guys. Do you honestly think that every other airline has "nicer" leadership? Somehow every other airline, regional, LCC, legacy, can somehow achieve an Agreement while you guys march towards 5 years since your amendable date.
I feel bad for you. You deserve better.
07-14-2012, 01:34 PM
#109
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 339
Oh, well how sweet of you. I like you save that little nibble for the end of your continued effort to belittle and discredit our pilot group.
The shortcomings of my union is nothing compared to your faux union's nonstop goal to gut our leverage for a better life.
The shortcomings of my union is nothing compared to your faux union's nonstop goal to gut our leverage for a better life.
07-14-2012, 01:37 PM
#110
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Wow, 11 pages of nuance regarding a strike that will never happen.
I truly feel for the guys flying the line at RAH, you deserve a better CBA. When all is said and done, your group will probably set a record for years between amendable date and ratification. That is not something to be proud of.
I can't believe there is not more of an uproar from the rank and file demanding more action. I read the PDU's and Negotiating committee updates and they sound like a High School student council debate. Childish name calling will get you nothing, and nothing is what you currently have.
Your Union let you believe that you would have a new CBA by last Christmas. Remember all of the excitement back when they were interviewed by the Local press in November 2011?
Your Union is still letting you believe that you will acheive something close to JBLU 190 rates.
Your Union is still letting you believe that they have some ace up their sleeve and you will be released to strike.
Your Union is still letting you believe that the result of a strike will be the CBA of your dreams.
I wish you all the best, I really do. I have participated in more than one CPA Section 6 negotiation. They are not fun.
The combination of poor performance by your leadership and the unrealistic expectations of the rank and file is a recipe for total disaster.
What happens if you do get your strike, and your TA, but it falls short of 99% of everyone's "wants"?
Your "11th hour" deal may be extremely similar to the deal currently on the table. What are you going to do then?
Recall your current leadership while working under yet another inferior CBA for another decade?
I would be asking everyone at the IBT Airline Division why Negotiations were halted completely for years. Meanwhile, during that unnecessary delay virtually every 50 seat operator has signed a concessionary deal or is standing on the precipices of BK. You have effectively delayed yourselves into the worst economic environment in aviation history to be negotiating rates for small RJ's. Where is the outrage from the rank and file?
Those of us looking on from the sidelines are scratching our heads, asking why you haven't done more for yourselves by now. This October will mark five year of nothing. I know all about BB and Henson and Hellar and how they are the bad guys. Do you honestly think that every other airline has "nicer" leadership? Somehow every other airline, regional, LCC, legacy, can somehow achieve an Agreement while you guys march towards 5 years since your amendable date.
I feel bad for you. You deserve better.
I truly feel for the guys flying the line at RAH, you deserve a better CBA. When all is said and done, your group will probably set a record for years between amendable date and ratification. That is not something to be proud of.
I can't believe there is not more of an uproar from the rank and file demanding more action. I read the PDU's and Negotiating committee updates and they sound like a High School student council debate. Childish name calling will get you nothing, and nothing is what you currently have.
Your Union let you believe that you would have a new CBA by last Christmas. Remember all of the excitement back when they were interviewed by the Local press in November 2011?
Your Union is still letting you believe that you will acheive something close to JBLU 190 rates.
Your Union is still letting you believe that they have some ace up their sleeve and you will be released to strike.
Your Union is still letting you believe that the result of a strike will be the CBA of your dreams.
I wish you all the best, I really do. I have participated in more than one CPA Section 6 negotiation. They are not fun.
The combination of poor performance by your leadership and the unrealistic expectations of the rank and file is a recipe for total disaster.
What happens if you do get your strike, and your TA, but it falls short of 99% of everyone's "wants"?
Your "11th hour" deal may be extremely similar to the deal currently on the table. What are you going to do then?
Recall your current leadership while working under yet another inferior CBA for another decade?
I would be asking everyone at the IBT Airline Division why Negotiations were halted completely for years. Meanwhile, during that unnecessary delay virtually every 50 seat operator has signed a concessionary deal or is standing on the precipices of BK. You have effectively delayed yourselves into the worst economic environment in aviation history to be negotiating rates for small RJ's. Where is the outrage from the rank and file?
Those of us looking on from the sidelines are scratching our heads, asking why you haven't done more for yourselves by now. This October will mark five year of nothing. I know all about BB and Henson and Hellar and how they are the bad guys. Do you honestly think that every other airline has "nicer" leadership? Somehow every other airline, regional, LCC, legacy, can somehow achieve an Agreement while you guys march towards 5 years since your amendable date.
I feel bad for you. You deserve better.
So while you are here, tell us all...how are things going at the courthouse? Word is the judge handed you guys yet ANOTHER setback. Things aren't looking too sporty for FAPAInvest and your little "deal" from what it sounds like. Guess you're hoping that the other side has really lousy forensic accountants.
That's the problem with good lawyers. They always know the answer to the question before they ask it. And 'ol BB won't throw you under the bus...he'll toss you in the fan stage to save his sorry self.
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