PerpetualFlyer

You're the biggest hypocrite around! Seriously? You've preached about the Bloch award and now this? You're a piece of work my friend, thanks for the chuckle!

MunkyButtr

Because he flys for VA now. Just look at his involvement on the VA thread. He really has no dog in this fight anymore. 98% of his posts are on VA and 9E threads. Notice all the VA specific commenta in his post.

ShyGuy

What hypocrisy? I never said Bloch award should be tossed (at least I don't think I did). I've been against it, sure, and yes I think we'd be better off with DOH with no fences or quotas, but I never said throw a binding arbitration award away. I've made comments that I saw an email talking about a potential DFR lawsuit against Pinnacle ALPA. But I know binding is binding, nothing can change that. What I DID want was clarification from Bloch regarding our low staffing quotas and the Saab fence. Apparently the 9E merger committee did seek clarification, but as of Aug 15 last year, Bloch never responded. Then we received no further updates on that cause. Now that the loss of the pinnacle 900s personally affects all three of the 9E merger committee members, somehow I think we WILL hear clarification of the 900 quotas in a displacement that is being disputed with the dispute resolution process.

johnso29

United isn't even hiring, so you wouldn't have been hired there. UsAir and United are operating on BK imposed rates. They don't have much of a choice. It's clear DP has no interest in combining the East and West groups. Point being, VA rates are terrible. They aren't the worst, but they still stink. And that's just rates. If we went into retirement, sick pay, and work rules I'm guessing we'd see VA drop very close to the bottom of the list.

It's funny how you chastise regional guys that argue over which regional is better, then you go and justify your decision to work for one of the lowest paying 320 operators out there by this. Look, I really don't care if you went to work for VA. I'm not out to bash guys that went to Sir Dick's US airline. They may be on furlough or they may have a family to support. They may just need a job to stay current. Maybe they just want to work there. I really don't care. But for you to tell regional guys they are all just pawns in managments game, while you're in training for Virgin America, is just hypocritical. VA is a LCC with shiny new airplanes and low labor costs. Hmmmm, sounds like that airline Colgan you consistently bash.

So answer me this. How are you any different?

johnso29

Now RAH still operates a few Q400's under the Frontier banner, correct? So RAH has a training program in place? Manuals, ops specs, etc? Tht would make it easier to strt operating these Q400's for UAL.

FlyJSH

So, have you started the union drive?

ShyGuy

True. But if I was, I'd start at $33/hr, which is about $11/hr less than what I make now. Some of those 2008 UAL furloughees came to VA and are now Captains. Quite a big difference what 4 years at United gets you (still furloughed) compared to 4 years at VA.

Not true. DP only saw that opportunity once the union's integration went south. The plan was to merge them and operate as one. When you say they don't have much a choice, that is false. US Air DID have a choice. They could have stuck with ALPA, moved on with the binding arbitration seniority list (NIC award), and then achieved the one contract that they pretty much had. Instead, they kicked ALPA out, formed USAPA, and USAPA ensured that the binding arbitration award wouldn't be accepted, and therefore a joined pilot contract would not be realized. The blame for US Air's current pay, contract, and predicament in general lies on USAPA, at least since 2008.

As already mentioned, in the playing field that exists today, it's still better than some others. For the pay year 2011/2012, VA FOs are on par with Spirit, and VA Captains years 1-7 actually make more than their counterparts at Spirit (Captain rates 1-7). It's higher than United, US Air, on par with Spirit, and lower than Delta and JetBlue. It falls right there in the middle of the pack.

You couldn't be more wrong, if only you knew my post history. Search it for yourself, and you will see I've ALWAYS chastised regional guys who argue over which regional is better. Always, and this was while I was at a regional. I assure you, my tone hasn't changed one bit regarding regionals from when I worked at one to when I left one.

It's a good company that is growing and offering jobs, while the rest of the industry is shrinking and laying off people. This year, VA and Spirit have been the only big time hiring carriers. Fedex and Alaska opened their window only for a short amount of time, but nothing close to hiring the kind of numbers VA and Spirit are going for. Even though you may not like it, 2012 is the year that two LCCs (Spirit and Virgin) have hired the most at the major/national level.

It is not hypocritical. I've always preached the same even when I was at a regional. Even back then I pointed out to all the RFPing of flying, giving Qs to non-union airline while telling us our ALPA contract would bankrupt Pinnacle, etc. I said time and time again we were pawns in managements game, and not to fall for it. There's no hypocrisy, and my post history proves that.

Are you serious? You're equating VA with Colgan? Colgan was a third-tier schmuk operation that started as being owned by a Senator. Don't take my word for it, just watch "Flying Cheap" and you will hear it for yourself. Shoddy maintenance practices, flying illegally with change of show times to stay under a 16 hr duty day, hiring low time pilots that would then get upgraded right at 1,500 hrs, putting at many times a combined experience of just 2,000 hrs in the flight deck. Colgan was a poorly run dirtbag operation, and the proof became evident after the BUF crash. Again, see "Flying Cheap" and you will see exactly what Colgan was.

More differences... VA is a stand-alone entity. It doesn't feed anyone. It doesn't bid for its flying. It has no mainline to answer to. Colgan, a non-union airline, was bought by union Pinnacle at a time Pinnacle was under contract negotiations. Then, Colgan was awarded 30 Q400s with money earned from the Pinnacle operation, and all of it was funneled to buy and grow Colgan. Those shiny planes came at the expense of every single employee at Pinnacle Airlines.

I don't even know why I'm arguing with you. The fact you'd call Branson "Sir Dick" and his "US airline" makes me think you were one of those ALPA types who filed to get VA grounded forever over foreign ownership rules. VA is a company that is owned legally by a majority controlling interest of US investors, and a minority interest by Branson himself. There's nothing wrong or illegal here. Pilots here make more than they would at United, US Air, and on par with Spirit flying the A320. We'll see what the future brings for United and US Airways. Until then, those facts still remain. And besides, shouldn't you be more concerned about why the (leaked) new payrates at Delta on the 737 are still well below Southwest? Or your scope section that may have eroded scope on 70-90 seaters? I think you have enough on your plate to worry about than to worry about "Sir Dicks" "US Airline."

Undrfly

You guys seriously need to find a hobby. Or start posting things that are actually useful to others. It looks like high school jabber. Sorry middle school jabber...

IBPilot

Well we all knew what was coming. The reality is the rest of us were too busy getting laid, working, family obligations, barhopping etc. to spread the obvious conclusions on some anonymous internet forum from our parent basement, or just don't give a crap if our predictions are right or not. Not all of us need to pat our internet predictions on the back to feed our ego.

MunkyButtr

Well, in the longest post in APC history ShyGuy finally admitted who he is. So, ShyGuy, take it to the VA threads and be gone once and for all. I'm still trying to figure out how a thread about Q400s turned into you defending VA to the death.