60av8tor

As a soon to be former mil with a class date early next year, I'm curious about this comment. Are you saying this as a former mil yourself? I understand all the comments about SRM vs. CRM, attitude, age, etc., but steep learning curve as compared to what? I can't speak for all mil programs, but I wager most students are learning fairly advanced aircraft while also learning all the airmanship knowledge that comes with being an aviator. 121 you should have 1/2 of that pretty well locked, right..?

CBreezy

His statement is a bit exaggerated. The biggest learning curve issues I've seen are the quick time frame to go from entering an aircraft to departing and a lot of radio issues in congested areas. Some of the older pilots both of age and of airplane struggle with automation management. It's nothing that can't be resolved in 6 months of line flying.

Adlerdriver

Hopefully your class is with a major airline. Go over to the major section of this forum and you'll find it's pretty rare to stumble on to a thread with these kinds of stupid blanket statements about mil guys.

That's because most guys coming out of the military have some common sense and apply it. If they've been flying single seat, they realize the crew coordination is going to be different. Since they still had crew coordination between aircraft and were highly reliant on that both during mission planning and actual flying, they usually adapt very well. Also, since the military operates a ton of crew aircraft, some pilots come out of the service quite familiar with a 2 or more person crew.

Finally, since most military guys bypass the regionals completely, the small number that these regional guys end up working with may be either problem children that couldn't get a recommendation or arrive with a chip on their shoulder. Either way, they're the exception to the rule, though you wouldn't think so listening to these guys. My guess is for every military guy who shows up and fulfills these bad stereotypes, there's an insecure civilian pilot whose looking for problems where there aren't, possibly washed out or never had a chance at a mil spot and is just happy to have a chance to criticize or validate himself. Most won't be that way, of course.

There are some new things to learn about company procedures and large civilian airports, new regs that now apply plus of course, the aircraft you're assigned to. Steep learning curve is all a matter of opinion, but it's not rocket science and not an issue for most guys who apply themselves. It's definitely easier than any military training you've done. So, you show up ready to learn and apply the same work ethic you have so far in your career. Keep an open mind, seek and take advice and be a team player. If you do that, things will work themselves out (even if you've never talked to ramp control or flown an RNAV arrival ). Good luck.

John Carr

To parse through some of the bovine scatology of what's going here, I'll interject this;

There's really ONLY ONE TREND, it's someone that can't simply check their ego, show up ready to learn, and do a good job.

It's NOT a mil/platform/service vs. civ thing, AT ALL.

It DOESNT matter if it was a "f-teen bro" or a "tanker bubba". It DOESNT matter if it's a former corporate guy, 135 guy, single engine freight guy, or whatever demographic you can think of. NO ONE wants to hear the pilot lament about "ya know, back in the Lear/Cheifton/freight/corporate/C-one/F-teen/super/mega/stealth/hawk/D-model squadron it was like this blah blah blah......" as they're screwing up a radio call, checklist, visual approach, or whatever. And sadly, when you get hired at a legacy, LCC, SLF company, whatever, it'll be THE SAME.

Worst case;

I remember having 20 something year old FO's go on and on about how he doesn't need to upgrade, because his buddy got hired at (legacy airline) with only a few thousand hours and he thinks he will too. Maybe he will. I ALSO remember flying with a mid 30's-mid 40's fresh off the military's rectum guy going on and on about how it's a slap in the face that he's at a regional, all his "bros" are at (insert airline) and he should be too. It swings BOTH WAYS.

At least I knew I'd be saving money on the trip. LAST pilot I'm gonna be buying beer/coffee for as I slam-click.

And to interject another point. You've had the BEST training in the world, there's NO DOUBT. But I'm sorry, you're simply not experienced enough in the 121 world to be a CA right out of the gate. Doesn't matter if it was at a regional flying the pretend Barbie Jet with only 50 of a legacy's customers on it or a 777 with over 300 of the legacy's on it. That may be hard to hear, but coming up on 20 years in this game, that's JUST THE TRUTH.

As far as your q's about quality of life, etc, it's all been covered and beat to death adnauseum over the various regionals.

Try to find the one with the quickest upgrade, where you won't have to commute, etc. if you hear of one that has "staffing issues/problems", that just means you'll get to fly a lot. And usually upgrade quicker.

And MOST IMPORTANTLY, start networking your rear end off, NOW!!!!!

If you haven't already.

Crazy Canuck

JC is on point^^

Plenty of new hire Flight Instructor idiots as well as military guys. The difference between mil and instructors? Mils usually figure it out, instructors tend to wash out.

Otterbox

As time goes on, you're likely going to see more military guys flying in the regionals thanks to increased service commitment time, and career diversification tours taking many of them out of the cockpits for their final 2-3 years of service. This has been a big trend with Navy Maritime pilots lately, and some of the AF Heavy crowd.

John Carr

I haven't seen the numbers, so it's all just hypothalating and speculization

But I think a lot of mil pilots are being soaked up, with less and less readily available. Check out the UAL and DAL threads. Guys that have filled out the app but have separation/available dates 1-2 years out are getting emails that basically say "when you are working 6 months of separation PLEASE contact us".

The legacies have ALWAYS valued military. What I'm getting at is, a loosening or relaxing on currency requirements for mil pilots. COMPARED TO NOW.

Besides, reading this board (and others) you'll see some mil guys getting picked up with less than (insert specific legacy's publicly announced at a job fair hours in the last year by the HMFIC of hiring here).

60av8tor

I really appreciate the replies. You can see by my join date vs. post count that I'm a bit hesitant to post on this type of forum. That comment just intrigued me as a soon to be 121 student. Definitely a lot of new aspects to learn in the 121 world and I look forward to it.

Class is with a regional. The majority of my flying was on the helo side, so I'm very happy to have the opportunity to enter the 121 world regardless of where I begin.

Good and bad aspects to everything I've done in my life thus far... I'm excited to begin and start learning the ropes.

Adlerdriver

I agree with this 100%. There's just too much to learn about being a 121 Captain to do it right away (to do it well, anyway). Exposure to that environment is really the only way to "get it".

Mandrake

For some reason this bothered me. It's happening. And if the guy doesn't want to upgrade it's really not any of your business. No reason to not buy the guy a coffee. Yeesh