Unions?
12-14-2015, 12:57 PM
#42
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2010
Posts: 81
Here’s a bold statement; the RLA is not the problem it is the NMB. The NMB is a government entity and as such, has a mission statement, not a goal.
The pertinent part of the NMB’s mission statement is:
“The prompt and orderly resolution of disputes arising out of the negotiation of new or revised collective bargaining agreements.”
The NMB has morphed over the years to believe it has a goal. In this regard they believe their underlying goal is a successful dispute resolution, not to mention the underlying pressure they are under to facilitate it based on an internal supposed 97% success rate of late.
Just as valid as facilitating a resolution however they are tasked with the obligation to define and recognize an impasse.
They have just as much responsibility to declare an impasse when it in fact exists, as they do to help find resolution.
They do not allow strikes, they do not allow work stoppages, and they do not allow lockouts. They do not allow anything.
They are supposed to declare an impasse when one exists within “some” reasonable time frame (see the word prompt in their mission) although lately (the last 30 yrs or so) they’ve been able to stretch it out to “denial of binding arbitration” as an excuse for not having “done their job”, as they see it.
If they see a release to self help as a failure, they have a personal problem. At that point the process has been undermined. It’s supposed to be a valid part of the process.
The Unions and the airline workers themselves should rally to insist on the original intent.
And just as an FYI; once the NMB has released to self help, there are built in delay tactics including a PEB but in the end the ONLY entity that can order a striking union under the RLA back to work is Congress, not the president.
It’s not the RLA that is the problem; the NMB over the years has been contaminated by politics and allowed through acquiescence to assume more power and control than was originally intended. It was never intended to actually infringe on workers rights only to determine the impasse was not arbitrary.
Take back you rights or believe you don’t have any, it’s up to you.
Just remember , the only tactic older than divide and conquer is to have the other side believe they have lost before the battle has begun.
Good Luck
The pertinent part of the NMB’s mission statement is:
“The prompt and orderly resolution of disputes arising out of the negotiation of new or revised collective bargaining agreements.”
The NMB has morphed over the years to believe it has a goal. In this regard they believe their underlying goal is a successful dispute resolution, not to mention the underlying pressure they are under to facilitate it based on an internal supposed 97% success rate of late.
Just as valid as facilitating a resolution however they are tasked with the obligation to define and recognize an impasse.
They have just as much responsibility to declare an impasse when it in fact exists, as they do to help find resolution.
They do not allow strikes, they do not allow work stoppages, and they do not allow lockouts. They do not allow anything.
They are supposed to declare an impasse when one exists within “some” reasonable time frame (see the word prompt in their mission) although lately (the last 30 yrs or so) they’ve been able to stretch it out to “denial of binding arbitration” as an excuse for not having “done their job”, as they see it.
If they see a release to self help as a failure, they have a personal problem. At that point the process has been undermined. It’s supposed to be a valid part of the process.
The Unions and the airline workers themselves should rally to insist on the original intent.
And just as an FYI; once the NMB has released to self help, there are built in delay tactics including a PEB but in the end the ONLY entity that can order a striking union under the RLA back to work is Congress, not the president.
It’s not the RLA that is the problem; the NMB over the years has been contaminated by politics and allowed through acquiescence to assume more power and control than was originally intended. It was never intended to actually infringe on workers rights only to determine the impasse was not arbitrary.
Take back you rights or believe you don’t have any, it’s up to you.
Just remember , the only tactic older than divide and conquer is to have the other side believe they have lost before the battle has begun.
Good Luck
12-14-2015, 02:38 PM
#44
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,150
This. This. Some units of ALPA actually give these to you to read upon joining...or at least they used to.
12-14-2015, 04:23 PM
#45
Living the Dream
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,795
Here’s a bold statement; the RLA is not the problem it is the NMB. The NMB is a government entity and as such, has a mission statement, not a goal.
The pertinent part of the NMB’s mission statement is:
“The prompt and orderly resolution of disputes arising out of the negotiation of new or revised collective bargaining agreements.”
The NMB has morphed over the years to believe it has a goal. In this regard they believe their underlying goal is a successful dispute resolution, not to mention the underlying pressure they are under to facilitate it based on an internal supposed 97% success rate of late.
Just as valid as facilitating a resolution however they are tasked with the obligation to define and recognize an impasse.
They have just as much responsibility to declare an impasse when it in fact exists, as they do to help find resolution.
They do not allow strikes, they do not allow work stoppages, and they do not allow lockouts. They do not allow anything.
They are supposed to declare an impasse when one exists within “some” reasonable time frame (see the word prompt in their mission) although lately (the last 30 yrs or so) they’ve been able to stretch it out to “denial of binding arbitration” as an excuse for not having “done their job”, as they see it.
If they see a release to self help as a failure, they have a personal problem. At that point the process has been undermined. It’s supposed to be a valid part of the process.
The Unions and the airline workers themselves should rally to insist on the original intent.
And just as an FYI; once the NMB has released to self help, there are built in delay tactics including a PEB but in the end the ONLY entity that can order a striking union under the RLA back to work is Congress, not the president.
It’s not the RLA that is the problem; the NMB over the years has been contaminated by politics and allowed through acquiescence to assume more power and control than was originally intended. It was never intended to actually infringe on workers rights only to determine the impasse was not arbitrary.
Take back you rights or believe you don’t have any, it’s up to you.
Just remember , the only tactic older than divide and conquer is to have the other side believe they have lost before the battle has begun.
Good Luck
The pertinent part of the NMB’s mission statement is:
“The prompt and orderly resolution of disputes arising out of the negotiation of new or revised collective bargaining agreements.”
The NMB has morphed over the years to believe it has a goal. In this regard they believe their underlying goal is a successful dispute resolution, not to mention the underlying pressure they are under to facilitate it based on an internal supposed 97% success rate of late.
Just as valid as facilitating a resolution however they are tasked with the obligation to define and recognize an impasse.
They have just as much responsibility to declare an impasse when it in fact exists, as they do to help find resolution.
They do not allow strikes, they do not allow work stoppages, and they do not allow lockouts. They do not allow anything.
They are supposed to declare an impasse when one exists within “some” reasonable time frame (see the word prompt in their mission) although lately (the last 30 yrs or so) they’ve been able to stretch it out to “denial of binding arbitration” as an excuse for not having “done their job”, as they see it.
If they see a release to self help as a failure, they have a personal problem. At that point the process has been undermined. It’s supposed to be a valid part of the process.
The Unions and the airline workers themselves should rally to insist on the original intent.
And just as an FYI; once the NMB has released to self help, there are built in delay tactics including a PEB but in the end the ONLY entity that can order a striking union under the RLA back to work is Congress, not the president.
It’s not the RLA that is the problem; the NMB over the years has been contaminated by politics and allowed through acquiescence to assume more power and control than was originally intended. It was never intended to actually infringe on workers rights only to determine the impasse was not arbitrary.
Take back you rights or believe you don’t have any, it’s up to you.
Just remember , the only tactic older than divide and conquer is to have the other side believe they have lost before the battle has begun.
Good Luck
12-14-2015, 04:51 PM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,198
That's all reasonable and I agree. The trouble is that even if you fix the NMB, the same political poisoning will eventually set back in, sadly making it a temporary fix. Repealing the RLA is a permanent solution, not that we shouldn't also strive to fix the NMB too.
12-14-2015, 04:59 PM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 857
That's all reasonable and I agree. The trouble is that even if you fix the NMB, the same political poisoning will eventually set back in, sadly making it a temporary fix. Repealing the RLA is a permanent solution, not that we shouldn't also strive to fix the NMB too.
12-14-2015, 05:01 PM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 480
I love this thread, it's extremely informative.
I've also noticed that those that do not work in the unions themselves don't fully understand the leverage that unions do or do not have. As said before, the RLA and NMB are the problem. We all hate the term "fly it and grieve it," but without the ability to put our foot down, we really have nothing else we can do about it. At the regional level, management will do what management wants to do. RAH is a prime example. Still having some attrition to other regionals even after the new contract due to the fact that you won't change the management perception. Doesn't matter how much you care for it and bring it back to life, a snake is still a snake and will continue to bite. If all of you really want to make a difference then read these and educate yourself. Write your senators, let them know how appealing the RLA really is and ask them to do their jobs and represent you like they are suppose to. Until then, complaining about unions at the regionals and griping on a forum wont change a thing.
I've also noticed that those that do not work in the unions themselves don't fully understand the leverage that unions do or do not have. As said before, the RLA and NMB are the problem. We all hate the term "fly it and grieve it," but without the ability to put our foot down, we really have nothing else we can do about it. At the regional level, management will do what management wants to do. RAH is a prime example. Still having some attrition to other regionals even after the new contract due to the fact that you won't change the management perception. Doesn't matter how much you care for it and bring it back to life, a snake is still a snake and will continue to bite. If all of you really want to make a difference then read these and educate yourself. Write your senators, let them know how appealing the RLA really is and ask them to do their jobs and represent you like they are suppose to. Until then, complaining about unions at the regionals and griping on a forum wont change a thing.
12-14-2015, 05:05 PM
#49
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,198
I love this thread, it's extremely informative.
I've also noticed that those that do not work in the unions themselves don't fully understand the leverage that unions do or do not have. As said before, the RLA and NMB are the problem. We all hate the term "fly it and grieve it," but without the ability to put our foot down, we really have nothing else we can do about it. At the regional level, management will do what management wants to do. RAH is a prime example. Still having some attrition to other regionals even after the new contract due to the fact that you won't change the management perception. Doesn't matter how much you care for it and bring it back to life, a snake is still a snake and will continue to bite. If all of you really want to make a difference then read these and educate yourself. Write your senators, let them know how appealing the RLA really is and ask them to do their jobs and represent you like they are suppose to. Until then, complaining about unions at the regionals and griping on a forum wont change a thing.
I've also noticed that those that do not work in the unions themselves don't fully understand the leverage that unions do or do not have. As said before, the RLA and NMB are the problem. We all hate the term "fly it and grieve it," but without the ability to put our foot down, we really have nothing else we can do about it. At the regional level, management will do what management wants to do. RAH is a prime example. Still having some attrition to other regionals even after the new contract due to the fact that you won't change the management perception. Doesn't matter how much you care for it and bring it back to life, a snake is still a snake and will continue to bite. If all of you really want to make a difference then read these and educate yourself. Write your senators, let them know how appealing the RLA really is and ask them to do their jobs and represent you like they are suppose to. Until then, complaining about unions at the regionals and griping on a forum wont change a thing.
12-14-2015, 05:11 PM
#50
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 757/767 First Officer
Posts: 366
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