Support Eagle and RAH pilots
03-10-2014, 07:08 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Position: Just because the MEL says we can, doesn't mean we should
Posts: 324
As an outsider looking in I don't see how voting down a TA means a turn for the industry. If it was that simple why not earlier or how did you end up with the current contract. Maybe they are trying to give you a worse one. If that is the case I totally understand but "change" the industry I don't.
Also don't be surprised at the outcome. I remember at 9E I thought a contract would never pass but it did as I was walking out the door. On the line "everyone" said they were a no vote.
What ever happened to "Ill pay you this to come work for me. If you don't like it leave." In the corporate world I sure don't blame XYZ's flight department for my agreement with my boss. But in 121 its other airlines fault. I remember 9E guys were mad at mesaba guys for a bit. Actually I think it was the other way around. Maybe I am to simple of a guy.
Also don't be surprised at the outcome. I remember at 9E I thought a contract would never pass but it did as I was walking out the door. On the line "everyone" said they were a no vote.
What ever happened to "Ill pay you this to come work for me. If you don't like it leave." In the corporate world I sure don't blame XYZ's flight department for my agreement with my boss. But in 121 its other airlines fault. I remember 9E guys were mad at mesaba guys for a bit. Actually I think it was the other way around. Maybe I am to simple of a guy.
03-10-2014, 07:24 PM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: CFI/II/MEI
Posts: 481
I couldn't agree more with what you have said. I believe what is different this time is that the majority of Eagle, Republic, Express, and ASA pilots are sending the message, "Pay us or shut the airlines down." We understand it could put us all on the streets, but for the first time I can remember the regional community is united and not giving in. The paradigm of how the "gold" is distributed will either change or the airlines mentioned will fold.
Edit: I would also like to add that we have had it with our respective union representation and our now uniting through forums and social media to take a stand not only against the company but the unions endorsing these TA's.
Edit: I would also like to add that we have had it with our respective union representation and our now uniting through forums and social media to take a stand not only against the company but the unions endorsing these TA's.
As someone that will hopefully join the regional game soon, I definitely support everyone and wish you all the best
.
03-10-2014, 08:03 PM
#23
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2011
Posts: 45
While most of what you said maybe true, I think you should also look at what the XJT pilots did recently. We have voted our equally industry leading TA down with an 83% resounding NO votes. This is not meant to toot our horn, but to let you know that this included the senior and mid term pilot group that you had mentioned.
Any pilot who has some self worth and thinks themselves as a professional, has understood that the bar should not be lowered any more. No one that I know of, myself included, wants that pot of Gold that is entrusted to the corporate elite.
The 83% from XJT would want our peers at Eagle and Republic to take a stand along with us to let our managements know that while they take their pay increases, we feel that we, as professionals, should be compensated properly with better pay, benefits and quality of life. I feel that if ever there was a time to take a stand for our profession, it is now. This is not only for us who are in the industry now but for those who will come after.
Any pilot who has some self worth and thinks themselves as a professional, has understood that the bar should not be lowered any more. No one that I know of, myself included, wants that pot of Gold that is entrusted to the corporate elite.
The 83% from XJT would want our peers at Eagle and Republic to take a stand along with us to let our managements know that while they take their pay increases, we feel that we, as professionals, should be compensated properly with better pay, benefits and quality of life. I feel that if ever there was a time to take a stand for our profession, it is now. This is not only for us who are in the industry now but for those who will come after.
03-10-2014, 08:04 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: bar stool
Posts: 771
If the pilot groups don't get this right, and push this in the right direction, then they never will. This is a chance that comes along once in a blue moon, and if it is not taken advantage of, you won't see it again in your regional "careers". Have some backbone, and vote no. Take the opportunity when it is flaunted in your face to improve your worth, for all pilots everywhere, and for your, and your families sakes.
03-10-2014, 09:40 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: emb-145 ca
Posts: 212
The Pot of Gold story is indeed the issue that makes reaching a solution so difficult with these regional managements. I really do believe them when they claim there is no money (from the current revenue stream of mainline payments) to support any contract improvements. They (mainlines) are pushing the regional system to failure as a result. Right now they are sacrificing the most expendable/non-critical portions of that system, but the vital organs will be under stress soon. Performance failures in terms of increasing cancelled flights will be the only thing that may bring forth a recalculation of CPA payment levels, or simply an abandonment of the CPA system and bring the operations in house to a great degree. They used whipsawed CPA deals because they could. That is no longer an option going forward, unless some mainline dumps a huge portion of it's regional pilot supply and makes them available on the market.
So, what can they do? Cut schedules? Fool/scare us with Comairing in the morning while they refleet with large RJs in the afternoon? Pay to stabilize the regional system? Buy the operations back and admit the regional model is finished?
So, what can they do? Cut schedules? Fool/scare us with Comairing in the morning while they refleet with large RJs in the afternoon? Pay to stabilize the regional system? Buy the operations back and admit the regional model is finished?
03-10-2014, 10:17 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 2,035
The Pot of Gold story is indeed the issue that makes reaching a solution so difficult with these regional managements. I really do believe them when they claim there is no money (from the current revenue stream of mainline payments) to support any contract improvements. They (mainlines) are pushing the regional system to failure as a result. Right now they are sacrificing the most expendable/non-critical portions of that system, but the vital organs will be under stress soon. Performance failures in terms of increasing cancelled flights will be the only thing that may bring forth a recalculation of CPA payment levels, or simply an abandonment of the CPA system and bring the operations in house to a great degree. They used whipsawed CPA deals because they could. That is no longer an option going forward, unless some mainline dumps a huge portion of it's regional pilot supply and makes them available on the market.
So, what can they do? Cut schedules? Fool/scare us with Comairing in the morning while they refleet with large RJs in the afternoon? Pay to stabilize the regional system? Buy the operations back and admit the regional model is finished?
So, what can they do? Cut schedules? Fool/scare us with Comairing in the morning while they refleet with large RJs in the afternoon? Pay to stabilize the regional system? Buy the operations back and admit the regional model is finished?
The "Pot of Gold story" is nothing but a total crock of *******! The bottom line is that mainline needs/wants feed to support their hubs, and regionals do a large portion of that. If every pilot group stands together refusing to continue letting our profession slide, they will have to pony up a bigger "Pot" or lose their feed. If no other groups pull a "Brownstreak" and sell out for shiny new jets, they won't be able to keep bidding lower and lower on their RFP's by counting on getting more and more concessions from the flight crews...
It really is that simple!
If there's enough money in their "Pot" to continually allow for double digit pay increases along with bonus after bonus for management, there should be enough to turn around the slide in our "profession"!
03-10-2014, 11:14 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: ERJ, CA
Posts: 718
American Airlines Group Inc. (AAL) is heading for an annual profit analysts estimate at $3.5 billion
American Record Profit Seen as Air Merger Buoys Industry - Bloomberg
American Record Profit Seen as Air Merger Buoys Industry - Bloomberg
03-11-2014, 04:53 AM
#28
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Posts: 154
I believe both groups will follow xjt and vote it down! Were all behind you! Dont worry, every airlines is threatening shut downs....Dont fall for the scare tactics.. Eagle, xjt and RAH arent going to shut down! 9,000 pilots cant be replaced!
03-11-2014, 06:00 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: CRJ700 F/O
Posts: 354
I hope you're right..from what I've heard from friends, RAH will be an overwhelming NO. I'm not sure if I can say the same about Eagle. While I think we'll vote it down, I don't know if we'll break 60-65%.
03-11-2014, 06:10 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Posts: 110
What people tend to forget about PSA is that this pilot group went through 2 bankruptcies and said no to concessions when offered airplanes a few years ago.
Where did the airplanes go? RAH and Mesa got the airplanes. They got burnt before and you expected them to get burnt again? They also were not the first to take concessions.
You have a very short memory.
Where did the airplanes go? RAH and Mesa got the airplanes. They got burnt before and you expected them to get burnt again? They also were not the first to take concessions.
You have a very short memory.
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