Wow, some powerful articles in the news
04-27-2014, 02:55 PM
#121
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Posts: 500
Envoy Partners With TCC With Pilot Shortage Looming - NewsOn6.com - Tulsa, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports - KOTV.com |
"In a time when few of us have job security, let alone a five-year-plan, Envoy, formerly American Eagle Airlines is offering Tulsa Community College students a job out of college and $10,000 in tuition reimbursement."
Wow, how generous of them. Now your flight training bill will only be $50,000-$90,000. But hey, you'll make it up at the rate of $22,000/year while sitting reserve 18 days a month in EWR! When they're serious they will pay 100% of tuition and flight training.
"In a time when few of us have job security, let alone a five-year-plan, Envoy, formerly American Eagle Airlines is offering Tulsa Community College students a job out of college and $10,000 in tuition reimbursement."
Wow, how generous of them. Now your flight training bill will only be $50,000-$90,000. But hey, you'll make it up at the rate of $22,000/year while sitting reserve 18 days a month in EWR! When they're serious they will pay 100% of tuition and flight training.
04-30-2014, 11:18 AM
#124
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2012
Posts: 34
Airline industry, congressmen square off over pilot shortage - City & Region - The Buffalo News
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
04-30-2014, 11:58 AM
#125
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,011
Airline industry, congressmen square off over pilot shortage - City & Region - The Buffalo News
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
04-30-2014, 01:58 PM
#127
Bracing for Fallacies
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: In favor of good things, not in favor of bad things
Posts: 3,543
Airline industry, congressmen square off over pilot shortage - City & Region - The Buffalo News
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
Interesting comments on this one. Seems much of the public sides with pilots. I found this comment interesting:
Maybe if the regional airlines paid their pilots better, more people would be willing to complete the training, and become pilots. I recently read that the average salary for a regional pilot was $26k a year, or $500 a week.
If the regional airlines would double that to $52k a year...$1000 a week, I'd be willing too bet that the pilot shortage would ease.
And before anyone steps up and says...oh my, higher pilot pay would make airline tickets go up tremendously, consider this. If a regional jet has 30 passengers (60% capacity) on each flight segment they fly, and they fly 6 segments a day, that is 180 passengers a day. If they fly 4 days a week, that is 720 passengers on their planes each week.
If you take the number of passengers on the pilots plane, 720, and divide it by the extra $500 a week you would pay the pilot and co-pilot ($1,000 total), that would equate to an additional $1.38 per ticket to cover the increase pay for the pilots.
Come on airlines...the math doesn't work. I'm not a pilot, but I can say as a frequent airline passenger, I'm really not all that comfortable knowing that the pilot responsible for my safety, is making under $30k a year. Pay your pilots, and watch the applications flow. This is not a training issue....trust me, more people would be willing to put in the training hours, if the job paid better. Don't cop out on safety, and use this as an excuse.
From the article,
" The regional airline industry today blamed a key safety requirement stemming from a deadly 2009 plane crash in Clarence for creating a pilot shortage, only to encounter congressmen from both parties who criticized the industry for not paying its beginning pilots enough."
This is why writing your Congressmen is SO important. Congress is being pummeled with management's "woe is me" argument. Thank goodness Congress is being informed of the realities of the industry, which takes *effort on our part* to defeat management's lobbying and $$$$.
Don't just complain in the forums, take real action. Please send a concise email or a snail mail to your congressman, union reps, etc.
Find Your Representative · House.gov
http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Elected.shtml
How to Write Your Congressman | The Art of Manliness
http://whoismyrepresentative.com
Find Your Senators and Representatives - OpenCongress
04-30-2014, 04:48 PM
#128
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2011
Position: SIM/GRND INSTRUCTOR
Posts: 53
News for today. Regional Airline Association asking congress for help!
RAA Asks Congress & FAA to Return Emphasis on Quality Versus Quantity Hours; Details Small Community Air Service Threat
Republic Airways Chairman, President and CEO Bryan Bedford explained how the FAA’s new 1500 hour First Officer Qualification (FOQ) rule has sparked a pilot shortage: “We cautioned lawmakers and regulators, throughout the lawmaking and regulatory process that including a largely inflexible and arbitrary flight-hour experience requirement as part of the final mandate would not only fail to improve safety, it would hasten the growing pilot shortage and imperil air service at communities across the country.”
RAA urged Congress and the FAA to work together to fix the pilot supply challenges emerging from the 1500 hour rule.
“I cannot think of a single greater challenge to air service to small and rural communities than the very real and significant pilot shortage facing US regional airlines and ultimately the flying public,” said Bedford.
“By emphasizing quality-of-training over an arbitrary flight time experience, instead of the reverse, we can pursue our goal of protecting the world’s safest aviation system, while preserving access to that system for communities large and small. At the same time, we will stimulate job creation throughout the entire aviation marketplace,” Bedford concluded.
Here is the article:
RAA Asks Congress & FAA to Return Emphasis on Quality Versus Quantity Hours; Details Small Community Air Service Threat
Everyone should write your Congressman and express your beliefs. I say more pay for what we do!
RAA Asks Congress & FAA to Return Emphasis on Quality Versus Quantity Hours; Details Small Community Air Service Threat
Republic Airways Chairman, President and CEO Bryan Bedford explained how the FAA’s new 1500 hour First Officer Qualification (FOQ) rule has sparked a pilot shortage: “We cautioned lawmakers and regulators, throughout the lawmaking and regulatory process that including a largely inflexible and arbitrary flight-hour experience requirement as part of the final mandate would not only fail to improve safety, it would hasten the growing pilot shortage and imperil air service at communities across the country.”
RAA urged Congress and the FAA to work together to fix the pilot supply challenges emerging from the 1500 hour rule.
“I cannot think of a single greater challenge to air service to small and rural communities than the very real and significant pilot shortage facing US regional airlines and ultimately the flying public,” said Bedford.
“By emphasizing quality-of-training over an arbitrary flight time experience, instead of the reverse, we can pursue our goal of protecting the world’s safest aviation system, while preserving access to that system for communities large and small. At the same time, we will stimulate job creation throughout the entire aviation marketplace,” Bedford concluded.
Here is the article:
RAA Asks Congress & FAA to Return Emphasis on Quality Versus Quantity Hours; Details Small Community Air Service Threat
Everyone should write your Congressman and express your beliefs. I say more pay for what we do!
Last edited by CaptainRJ; 04-30-2014 at 04:50 PM. Reason: editing
04-30-2014, 06:50 PM
#129
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 121
So Mr. Bedford and company want the "good old days" of inexperienced pilots back eh? No amount of training can replace experience. But I'm pretty sure they know that very well. They are not detailing any "air service threat". Get real. They are detailing a threat to their GREED.
This is actually a good sign, in that it reveals the immature mentality of some of these owners. They would rather sacrifice safety by having wet certificate holding teenagers for whom the opportunity to fly a "bad a$$ jet" is pay enough than to reassure the flying public by hiring well trained AND well experienced professionals and properly compensating them.
I actually ran into a guy back in 2002 that was barely 19 years old, had a TT of 263 hours and felt like there was -no reason whatsoever- that the regional airlines shouldn't hire him.
Really?
Turns out he actually -did- get hired not too long afterwards...by Mr. Colgan.
Regardless of training, most people want to know how much experience you have, and will commonly make judgements and decisions based on that alone. This holds true not only in aviation, but in ALL industries, especially where life, limb, and/or any substantial impact is at stake. Right or wrong, that's the way it has been and is the way it always will be. Personally, I think it's right. I'll let a beginner painter have a go at my old riding mower, but they will not so much as touch my car!
I hope Congress and the FAA sends them packing without giving any of it a second thought. From a safety standpoint, the new rules are the best thing to happen and I hope they stand. Even if a person goes out and buys all the time, there -will- be unavoidable experiences that will serve to build a better, safer pilot.
This is actually a good sign, in that it reveals the immature mentality of some of these owners. They would rather sacrifice safety by having wet certificate holding teenagers for whom the opportunity to fly a "bad a$$ jet" is pay enough than to reassure the flying public by hiring well trained AND well experienced professionals and properly compensating them.
I actually ran into a guy back in 2002 that was barely 19 years old, had a TT of 263 hours and felt like there was -no reason whatsoever- that the regional airlines shouldn't hire him.
Really?
Turns out he actually -did- get hired not too long afterwards...by Mr. Colgan.
Regardless of training, most people want to know how much experience you have, and will commonly make judgements and decisions based on that alone. This holds true not only in aviation, but in ALL industries, especially where life, limb, and/or any substantial impact is at stake. Right or wrong, that's the way it has been and is the way it always will be. Personally, I think it's right. I'll let a beginner painter have a go at my old riding mower, but they will not so much as touch my car!
I hope Congress and the FAA sends them packing without giving any of it a second thought. From a safety standpoint, the new rules are the best thing to happen and I hope they stand. Even if a person goes out and buys all the time, there -will- be unavoidable experiences that will serve to build a better, safer pilot.
04-30-2014, 07:32 PM
#130
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2014
Posts: 44
Where the hell are our unions in this???? Where are the lobbyist that our unions have greased? How come they don't have the names, emails and fax numbers to every member of congress that is involved in our email boxes? I think it's time for some house cleaning, toot suite....
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
