cactusmike

Look, ALPA has had it's issues long before the RJ versus mainline scope clause came up. At America West we were always the bastard stepchild of ALPA along with the other National carriers. When we merged with US Air ALPA national bent over backwards to try to renegotiate the arbitrated award that was done under ALPA merger policy. Prater, the Alpa national president, delayed giving the arbitrated list to the company under pressure from the AAA MEC. Ultimately that delay gave impetus to USAPA being formed and ALPA lost 5500 dues paying members. Before the AWA/AAA merger we had ALPA National telling us to accept our first contract, a substandard contract, because "it was as good as you deserve".

Before AWA I was at Henson. The (original) Piedmont ALPA guys told us that if we voted ALPA in we would be taken care of and we would be on the list like the Empire guys had done. Heck, we would have been happy with a flow through. After a couple of years of seeing nothing done I bailed for AWA, while a lot of my peers hung around for that flow that never happened. Lucky for me I left, Piedmont was ruined when they merged into US Air.

ALPA has always been run by the big airlines. Every small carrier was just a dues source for the association. Yes, the support structure is there, the committee training is excellent, but you don't really have much of a say in the overall direction of ALPA. I have been getting the PDF version of the magazine for the past year and I have never read such self serving BS anywhere else. ALPA is flawed and they are too busy patting each other on the a$$ in Herndon to fix the issues.

Go back to the days of the RJ Coalition at Comair. The scope deal has been festering for decades now. Management liked the idea of small shiny jets until Jet A went above 50 bucks a barrel. They just looked at market share and trip costs, not the revenue that they lost out on by down gauging from a 110 seat mainline jet to a 50 seat RJ. SWA didn't use RJs for a reason, they can be very expensive. The regional industry keeps evolving and the regionals in the next 10 years will be very different from today. I think it will go back to looking more like the original commuter feeds of the

The majors are now looking at what they need for feed and what the costs need to be. Unfortunately the days of 30 cents a seat mile yield that we had at the commuter in the 80s are gone, except for maybe Alaska. Regional guys are being squeezed on costs because you are contract carriers. With the proliferation of regionals and the need to constantly bid for contracts the cost pressures are going to remain. The only end to this will be the inevitable culling of the weaker regionals and the consolidation that results.

Regional wages will decline until regional pilots get some pricing power. I know we have all heard of the upcoming mega pilot shortage but the numbers do in fact say that in the next 5 years all those regional seats will start to get unfilled. Look at Great Lakes. It's not going to get better for the regional's filling classes until the pay comes up, and that's a 3 or more year lag time from when someone starts flight training. They are going to have to make this an attractive industry to entice new starters.

This shortage, though, will be ignored by management until flights get cancelled, and that is several years away. As I stated, with a surplus of regional airlines looking for contracts to fly there will be a huge pressure to come in at the lowest bid. Lowest bid means pressure on wages because employee costs are the easiest expense to cut. I wish it were not so but history seems to back me up.

PCL_128

No, an individual told you those things: Moak. ALPA isn't the problem. It's easy to replace a bad individual. It's not easy to build a new union from scratch. Wake up!

PCL_128

Bulls---. Show the letter.

Captain Tony

Hey Todd, how come you never got ALPA at Gulfstream?

Lambourne

Actually I wasn't arguing. I was supporting the OP in the quest to leave ALPA. The major carrier pilots have been arguing for years about the conflict of interest and the mass amount of our dues dollars that go to supporting the regional carriers MEC's. At the major carriers we have battled B-Scale. 9-11, BK, mergers etc. We have had concessionary contracts and incremental increases, large increases, large decreases and now some increases again. We have had to fight our own battles using OUR pilots doing OUR union work.

The RJ carriers seen to think they don't need wise union leaders. Just hit the ALPA national autopilot button and let the magenta line lead you to the promised. It just doesn't work like that. What is really amusing is the first time these RJ carriers hit a path of adversity they want to overthrow ALPA. That is fine by me as I think it helps my national union. Just remember the same weak pilot group with ALPA as the union is the same weak pilot group without.

Dutch1

Mainline negotiates scope. Giving up scope means giving up cities. You're making a distinction without a difference. And when those are the only jobs available, those aspiring for better are not to blame for taking them for attempting to use them as stepping stones.

todd1200

I think he's referring to the letter from ALPA National VP Tom Maxwell to the Eagle MEC where he says:

"You want to make your decisions in accordance with ALPA policy. It is certainly within your rights to interpret the ALPA Administrative Manual more restrictively than actual ALPA National policy. Should you elect to adopt a more restrictive interpretation of one section of policy at the expense of other existing ALPA policy you may be placing yourselves at legal risk. That is your conundrum and you should take full advantage of the legal counsel available to you. You do have the authority to decide to make this choice of a literal or more restrictive interpretation. I recommend that you fully address this as you determine how to proceed with the final offer from the Company.

As a final thought I would ask you to consider in your deliberations that you are acting on behalf of more than 3300 unsecured creditors known as American Eagle pilots. In addition to your regular responsibilities to advance each member’s career under the Railway Labor Act you are also acting to minimize adverse impacts from bankruptcy on each of them. Remembering that the bankruptcy code is designed to protect the bankrupt entity and less so about protecting the creditors. The Company is offering a plan that would keep American Eagle a substantial carrier for our members. You should not take any action that could result in the “Comairing” of American Eagle. I would suggest that each of you consider this dual role and your individual and corporate liabilities under the law."

I think the bolded could be understood in a couple different ways.

AxialFlow

Of course. To meddle in the affairs of individual airlines would expose ALPA National to the risk of lawsuits. ALPA National cares about the profession...to a certain point.

TMoney

You don't think that will come sooner? With all the XJET double time and Republic's Q400 operation it seems like this summer may already see cancellations at some of the larger regionals....

AxialFlow

Quite the predicament all of the ALPO cheerleaders have created. Who is ALPO? ALPO is the pilots. But when pilots point the finger at ALPO...ALPO points the finger right back at the pilots. Who is right? Looks like a Mexican standoff.