TBucket

Thereby making you unemployable at any other airline after a few years. I mean, why hire someone with 20 years longevity when you can get a fresh SJS kiddie out of the school of the day and start him at year 1?

Ultralight

Listen buddy. I did not say senior guys should leave and start at the bottom. That's the one thing I would try to prevent! We are talikng about fixed rates for F.O's and captains. If that were to be implemented the airline's payroll would be predictable and consistant. About the only thing in this industry that would be. Knowing what your labor costs are going to be a couple of years down the road would be huge.
New airlines that suddenly appear (I'm sure we know who,) start with year 1 F.O.'s and year 1 Captains with no vacation accumulated and little to no 401k match. Guess what happens? They get awarded more flying because they are cheaper than everyone else. Of course 5-10 years from now they too will have people on a 10 year pay scale, and suddely you see Jets "R" Us come along, under bid them and the whole thing starts all over again.
Asking the government to interfere is not the solution!

flyingreasemnky

The unions make it a requirement in a contract to abide by the national longevity list. Besides 20 years doesn't really matter when an FO list max's out at 4-6 years. Its ridiculous when you have 20 year pay scales when mainline only has 12 (usually). So in the end, there wouldn't be much of a cost increase to the company. The airline then gets someone who is qualified and they know can pass training. Additionally, by having people that more than meet the minimums, the insurance for the company would go down. It would definitely take some negotiating capital to get there but it would benefit the entire profession.

The big question is will there be enough SJS kiddies in the future to start at year 1 and as of right now, no. There are going to be a lot of guys getting furloughed that could fill the spots but they are talking about leaving the industry all together rather than starting over.

mojo6911

They also make new hires go through their own 40k+ type rating course. Not exactly an ideal situation for the pilot group. Trust me, as a pilot, you don't want your company emulating anything they do.

Ultralight

Well a 737 type is expensive in Europe. They don't want to train pilots just for them to take their type rating elsewhere. Southwest insists that their applicants have, or will have a 737 type too. Ryanair nickles and dimes their passengers for everything but their pilots are very well compensated.
I was more refering to the fixed salary for their pilots though.

XO jet pays F.O.'s $52,200 a year and their captains $90,000 regardless of longevity. I'm sure most regional guys would agree to that payscale. Although they are a fractional, its still fair compensation for a professional pilot.

Airline Pilot Central - XO Jet | Fractional

mojo6911

There is a big difference. Southwest doesn't care where you do the type rating, and to my knowledge, Ryan Air forces you to go through their overpriced type rating course on your own dime.

They charge their pilots for a bottle of water (no joke). No sick pay, no insurance.

High price for aspiring pilots to pay for commercial airline grade - The Irish Times - Fri, Jul 06, 2012

Apparently, they now make all of their new hires "temps" for lack of a better word. Here is a quote from PPRUNE:

Ultralight

Any aviation related training in Europe is outrageously expensive but Ryaniar does pay well. I have friends over there who are making plenty. Insurance is not needed in the U.K. because it has government run healthcare (NHS)
I'm not trying to endorse the way they do business over there, just making the point that fixed salaries for pilots brings much more stability to an otherwise volatile industry.
You can't control the price of fuel but if your labor costs are fixed it helps tremendously when it comes to bidding contracts etc.
I remember Ryanair playing with the idea of charging to use the restroom and having standing rather than a seat. I think they are deliberately trying to draw attention to themselves through the media. Adverising is expensive and they can get publicity without paying for it they. People think Ryanair, cheapas*es but subconsciously they think they are getting the lowest price and book their ticket anyway.

embraer

Ultralight if you love Ryanair so much create a new thread about them. This thread is about Eagle.

FYI: any pilot with half a brain would stay the hell away from Ryanair. Their CEO is a crackpot to say the least. Just recently he attempted, and failed miserably, to get approval for single pilot operations. He was also the genius who wanted standing room only sections on his aircraft.

Ultralight

I don't love Ryanair embraer. Just using them as an example of an airline that uses a single pay scale. They are very sucessful financially so it woud be foolish to ignore the way they do business. Like I said, they come up with these outrageous ideas to attract media attention. Even if its negative attention its still free advertising. Donald trump does the same thing all the time.

I will take your point about the thread drift though. Back to Eagle, if you quit within 2 years you simply refund the $5,000, pro rated or the whole thing?
Sounds like less of a risk than $5,000 for a $20,000 early buy out that Republic is offering.

TheFly

Sure did. Why are they hiring when they are losing AA flying?