TeddyKGB

Long over due. No one with 500 hours and no commercial flying experience has no business sitting in the right seat of a 121 jet carrying passengers, or cargo for that matter.

Leroy Smith

Will an ATP be required to get hired??
Of course you will need the mins before being able to obtain an ATP. And no company would hire you if you would not have them. But as to the Level D hrs requirement, wouldnt most initial training programs cover that many times over?? And the PC/AQP would certainly allow for issuance of an ATP, as we are seeing now for FOs who have the mins.

DryMotorBoatin

True but roger Cohen and company devalue instructing and other time building jobs so that sitting in the right seat of a crj900 is an entry level job justifying pitiful wages. The harder it is ad the more sacrifice required toget to that 121 job will cause people to demand more and see their own value .

minimwage4

That was in 1997! And I'm pretty sure a lot of 1st year pilots make less than 26k today!!!

I think in order for pilots to get to 1500 they would actually need students.... Not to mention there would actually have to be people willing to become airline pilots. I just don't see how this profession would be as appealing as it used to be. Even if pay and benefits go up dramatically, the current system makes it almost impossible for someone to start training unless they go through the GI bill or have 50 to 100k lying around. Who's going to give you a loan to be a pilot? I'm sure many use their dad's credit card but that's not going to produce enough bodies to fill the empty seats. Add in the fact that there's going to be a lot more retirements now. I can understand how this ATP rule will benefit the supply and demand for us but it can also hurt us where it will put a hamper on growth or even reduction of flying because there aren't enough pilots.

fullflank

Dont forget that there are quite a few current pilots who are looking for an opportunity to leave the biz altogether. I know im one. As the economy begins to turn around those opportunities will become more available.

FlyJSH

Do you call that a triple negative or a double-double negative?

rickair7777

I seriously doubt any regionals will require the ATP, just meet the mins. It essentially costs them nothing to give you the ATP during initial training, and any regional would be at a recruiting disadvantage if they required an ATP but every other regional gave them away for free.

Regionals are starting to get nervous about the "pilot shortage".

Dan64456

Also the parents that save up money for 20 years just to shell it out to their spoiled brat upper-middle class main line son or daughter... This is the reciprocal of the pilot pay issue; they pay for the tuition for their kids outright which increases the demand of said 'education' which in turn raises the price for everyone.
Someone here said it so eloquently once before... The speedboats and Corvettes of the middle aged population from the 80's has become tuition for "Colin" and "Aiden" for the new middle agers.

Another topic:
I see lots of (understandably) mixed opinions about ATP flight school around here...
What do you think of a Private Pilot (obtained from a mix of local FBO's) who goes to ATP part time self funded while working in another career field? (with a BS degree already, working on changing careers)

Personally, I've had instructors from ATP, UND, and Riddle at my FBO's and they have all been great... The guys from ATP were definitely more thorough, some were 35 years old, etc... I guess like anything else it's what you make of it and take from it? I know of a few instructors/students at ATP who were Air-force and Navy guys.. Perhaps it's better now and brings in people from more varied backgrounds these days (instead of only rich suburban kids?)

Just looking to see what people's general opinions are since it's hard to get into these days, even if you went military... (many people who go that route never get to touch an airplane even if they wanted to) Hell I can't even find an FBO within 50 miles radius that has a Multi. The one I used to go to ditched the twin for a Cirrus. It seems that ATP is really becoming one of only option for lot's of people who want to get into the career if they are currently working in another field (they have locations all over the place, and moving to Florida or Kansas isn't an option if you want to keep your current job / home).
Make no mistake tho, I am not in a hurry, and will not leave my job for anything less than 50k... I have no problem instructing part time while working FT at my current job... as long as I'm flying I'm happy.. the hobby thing I tried years ago... too expensive.. too hard to stay current. But at least if I was instructing it would translate to beer money and hours in the log book, which might lead to options down the road... I just want to see what people are thinking of ATP these days, since it's probably a different place than it was a few yrs ago, and since most FBO's can't afford to keep a twin. I also know it's not all about twin time anymore, now it's the race to 1500, but as it stands now, they still want 100ME to get you started... Don't know where else you can get that...

brianb

The first part of your post has to be one of the dumbest things I have read in years. I take it you would prefer that we send our kid's through the "higher education" system only to come out the other side hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt? Granted, not every aspiring college/flight school student has parents that can afford to pay today's astronomical prices but, if possible, would you rather we didn't? Great, I can now buy my Corvette which in turn will tow my speedboat. Save today so that tomorrow can be had. Do yourself and your kid's a favor, take control where you can.

Dan64456

I take it you are one of those parents? In my relatively few life experiences, the kids that were coddled by their parents and had a free ride through college turned out to be some of the least respectful, condescending, most ungrateful d-bag's I've ever encountered. On the flip-side I understand some of them turn out to be great people as well, but you get my point... I view it as doing them a favor to help them where needed, but not giving them an entirely free ride... I don't have or desire to have kids though (also couldn't afford to if I wanted to), but if I did, I'd feel like it would be beneficial to them in the long run to raise them without carte blanche to my credit card. I don't condone the Corvettes or speedboats either, but you can't deny the truth in that paradigm shift. Maybe I'm just biased, or maybe I just don't like a land of unequal opportunity.