Another drunk pilot
02-18-2012, 02:11 PM
#101
I'm a man of my word.
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: Devil's Advocate
Posts: 2,883
Addiction - a continued involvement with a substance or activity despite the negative consequences associated with it. Wiki
Example - Alcoholism, Aviation Career ect.
Knowingly pursuing something that does you harm in the long run. We all are guilty of that or else we would have become plumbers or dentists.
Skyhigh
Example - Alcoholism, Aviation Career ect.
Knowingly pursuing something that does you harm in the long run. We all are guilty of that or else we would have become plumbers or dentists. Skyhigh
The airline pilot life lends itself well to alcoholism. You are always on the road a midst unfamiliar surroundings and strangers most of the time. Biorhythms are perpetually askew. Awake when you should be asleep and trying to sleep when you are alert. Add to that the depression that comes along with the messed up body clock, bad diet, loneliness, loss of self worth and poverty. People tend to self medicate. A little booze can make instant best friends out of those you haven't met before and make a cold concrete hotel room feel like home.
Skyhigh
Skyhigh
That being said, it's possible to pull yourself out of a rut. It just takes the determination of an addict
02-18-2012, 04:11 PM
#102
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: CRJ CA
Posts: 328
I bet the van driver who snitched feels like a hero right now. And don't worry I'm not saying he is a jerk for telling on the suspected drunk pilot or anything, nor am I saying to turn the other cheek.
With this driver being the one who called it in, I bet this week 50 other hotel van drivers wanna be the next hero of the day and call the cops on crews they might suspect so they themselves can feel heroic. Just like TSA screeners love to be the hero who nails the next drunk pilot.
With this driver being the one who called it in, I bet this week 50 other hotel van drivers wanna be the next hero of the day and call the cops on crews they might suspect so they themselves can feel heroic. Just like TSA screeners love to be the hero who nails the next drunk pilot.
02-18-2012, 04:49 PM
#103
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,342
I bet the van driver who snitched feels like a hero right now. And don't worry I'm not saying he is a jerk for telling on the suspected drunk pilot or anything, nor am I saying to turn the other cheek.
With this driver being the one who called it in, I bet this week 50 other hotel van drivers wanna be the next hero of the day and call the cops on crews they might suspect so they themselves can feel heroic. Just like TSA screeners love to be the hero who nails the next drunk pilot.
With this driver being the one who called it in, I bet this week 50 other hotel van drivers wanna be the next hero of the day and call the cops on crews they might suspect so they themselves can feel heroic. Just like TSA screeners love to be the hero who nails the next drunk pilot.
That kind of prejudice is the same kind that makes people think we make a ton of money doing nothing, drinking all the time, and just complaining for the sake of complaining.
I say kudos to the van driver. Not only did he prevent a major comprise to safety, but he also saved the other pilot from having to explain how he let the flight takeoff without noticing his coworker was drunk.
02-18-2012, 05:30 PM
#104
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: FO - 757/767
Posts: 1,228
Just because a quick wikipedia search tells us it's a disease, doesn't make it one. Gramma was a lush (big time). I never thought that it was anything other than her own fault. Let me ask you and usmcflyer: is being a pedophile a disease? When did it happen in this world where personal responsibility became extinct? Al, you sound as if you have personal experience with alcohol abuse (you or loved one); if so, I'm sorry. But, don't patronize them or yourself and do them a disservice by taking responsibility and putting it elsewhere. My personal beliefs? Life is perception, and I'm not buying into everything people tell me (as you do). And as far as my kids having "the gene", well if I raise them right to be responsible adults, they will never have to worry about getting the "disease".
02-18-2012, 05:35 PM
#105
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: FO - 757/767
Posts: 1,228
02-18-2012, 05:36 PM
#106
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
Just because a quick wikipedia search tells us it's a disease, doesn't make it one. Gramma was a lush (big time). I never thought that it was anything other than her own fault. Let me ask you and usmcflyer: is being a pedophile a disease? When did it happen in this world where personal responsibility became extinct? Al, you sound as if you have personal experience with alcohol abuse (you or loved one); if so, I'm sorry. But, don't patronize them or yourself and do them a disservice by taking responsibility and putting it elsewhere. My personal beliefs? Life is perception, and I'm not buying into everything people tell me (as you do). And as far as my kids having "the gene", well if I raise them right to be responsible adults, they will never have to worry about getting the "disease".
And to answer your other question, I'll use part of your research method:
From Wiki:
As a medical diagnosis, pedophilia (or paedophilia) is defined as a psychiatric disorder in adults or late adolescents (persons age 16 or older) typically characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children (generally age 13 years or younger, though onset of puberty may vary). The child must be at least five years younger than the adolescent (16 or older) to be termed pedophilia.[1][2][3][4]
The term has a range of definitions, as found in psychiatry, psychology, the vernacular, and law enforcement. The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) defines pedophilia as a "disorder of adult personality and behaviour" in which there is a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.[5] According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), pedophilia is a paraphilia in which a person has intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children and on which feelings they have either acted or which cause distress or interpersonal difficulty.[1]
The term has a range of definitions, as found in psychiatry, psychology, the vernacular, and law enforcement. The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) defines pedophilia as a "disorder of adult personality and behaviour" in which there is a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.[5] According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), pedophilia is a paraphilia in which a person has intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children and on which feelings they have either acted or which cause distress or interpersonal difficulty.[1]
USMCFLYR
02-18-2012, 05:42 PM
#107
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
You seem to miss this point and believe that the two are at odds with each other.
So....besides the way that you chose to believe - what sort of proof are you willing to offer to those of us who disagree with your view? Any research out there from those whom you don't think are just trying to lead us down some rose trimmed path?
USMCFLYR
02-18-2012, 06:21 PM
#108
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: blueJet
Posts: 4,536
I think we're getting stuck on the term "disease".
Some would consider addictions, shyness, shell shock, tourettes, and poverty to be diseases.
Others would consider a disease to be something like AIDS, Measles, Leprosy, or a burning case of the clap. If you look with a microscope you can see bacteria or a virus or something. If you get it on you, you can get infected. If you eradicate it from the body, you are cured.
I fall into the second group of people. When someone says alcoholism, smoking, kleptomania, or obesity are diseases, I find myself thinking "how can it be a disease when it's a behavior?" Do germs make you crave french fries? If gambling is a disease, than could laziness be a disease? Is child abuse a disease? Is aging a disease? Is that guy covered with tattoos from head to toe because he has a disease? How can someone who hasn't had a drink in 30 years still be sick today?
I blame the doctors for confusing things. If I break my leg, I have a medical condition. That doesn't make it a disease. If I cut myself intentionally or fear shoes, I have a mental condition. That doesn't make it a disease.
I have no doubt that alcoholism is a disorder, a condition, whatever; but when they classify it as a "disease" they're rubbing my paradigm the wrong way.
Of course I don't have any alcoholics or doctors in my family, so I guess I'm double ignorant.
Some would consider addictions, shyness, shell shock, tourettes, and poverty to be diseases.
Others would consider a disease to be something like AIDS, Measles, Leprosy, or a burning case of the clap. If you look with a microscope you can see bacteria or a virus or something. If you get it on you, you can get infected. If you eradicate it from the body, you are cured.
I fall into the second group of people. When someone says alcoholism, smoking, kleptomania, or obesity are diseases, I find myself thinking "how can it be a disease when it's a behavior?" Do germs make you crave french fries? If gambling is a disease, than could laziness be a disease? Is child abuse a disease? Is aging a disease? Is that guy covered with tattoos from head to toe because he has a disease? How can someone who hasn't had a drink in 30 years still be sick today?
I blame the doctors for confusing things. If I break my leg, I have a medical condition. That doesn't make it a disease. If I cut myself intentionally or fear shoes, I have a mental condition. That doesn't make it a disease.
I have no doubt that alcoholism is a disorder, a condition, whatever; but when they classify it as a "disease" they're rubbing my paradigm the wrong way.
Of course I don't have any alcoholics or doctors in my family, so I guess I'm double ignorant.
02-18-2012, 06:33 PM
#109
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,342
It really does not matter what we call it. Let MDs discuss the terminology on their forum. Flying while drunk is a problem. Get the pilot off the plane and off the line. Have that person go to court where a judge can give them a slap in the face and some extra motivation to get better. Go get treatment and convince the FAA you are safe to fly. Then send your resume out and interview. If someone sees all the work that person has done to get back in the industry and likes them so much they are willing to hire someone with an alcohol offense on their record, good for them.
02-18-2012, 07:00 PM
#110
Day puke
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: Out.
Posts: 3,865
If someone really wanted to make a pilot's life bad, telling authorities he was drunk is a good way. Why not let this all play out before the crucifixions begin?
I would rethink that a bit. My parents raised three sons all the same way, all with the same genes, and only one of us has been an alcoholic for nearly 40 years.
As one friend of Bill W. described it, "The need for a drink is akin to being held underwater as your breath runs out. Eventually you suck in the water even though you know it will kill you. Recovery is as easy as learning not to inhale."
Just because a quick wikipedia search tells us it's a disease, doesn't make it one. Gramma was a lush (big time). I never thought that it was anything other than her own fault. Let me ask you and usmcflyer: is being a pedophile a disease? When did it happen in this world where personal responsibility became extinct? Al, you sound as if you have personal experience with alcohol abuse (you or loved one); if so, I'm sorry. But, don't patronize them or yourself and do them a disservice by taking responsibility and putting it elsewhere. My personal beliefs? Life is perception, and I'm not buying into everything people tell me (as you do). And as far as my kids having "the gene", well if I raise them right to be responsible adults, they will never have to worry about getting the "disease".
As one friend of Bill W. described it, "The need for a drink is akin to being held underwater as your breath runs out. Eventually you suck in the water even though you know it will kill you. Recovery is as easy as learning not to inhale."
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
