belliott

Why is it that low time pilots whom graduate from four year universities can usually get hired with a regional airline well before they can meet 135 mins.? Is there a difference in insurance policies or is it because 121 operators have two pilots instead of just one? Being a soon to be graduate I find it hard to believe that boxes require more time than people... if that sentence makes any sense. What do you think? Just a thought.
Thanks!

sigmetron

I have attended a A/C maintenance college for 3 years, ( 1 Semester away from my A&P), and another FAA "pilot" college afterwards for another 3 years, and although I had all my ratings beforehand, and have got a Masters and an Bachelors in Aeronautics. I and still am unable to get a 121 job, I was in a pool for ASA for six months, until yesterday, (I recieved a letter saying that there was a discrepancy in my application). In College, however, I observed the protocol that is favorable to corperations when it comes to scooping up low time graduates.
Simply put, in order to get through the program, they are conditioned TO BE PROGRAMMED, not that thats' a bad thing,(remember, "a good pilot is always learning"), but H.R. is sold that bill of goods that, unfortunatly, we all have to live by, because, H.R. believes they will make for a better investment in the long run. Just imagine if Harvard, or Yale procured a well seasoned oak barrel of an aviation department. Those grads would be running the aviation industry after 5 years.

kansas

The degree from such a college itself cannot offer you much over anyone else...but...It's ALL politics. Those that go to such schools probably run into more pilots, have more pilot-friends, and thus, have more of those coveted connections to the industry.

Also...many of these schools have internships and bridge programs that FBO's cannot offer. Interns are building valuable firsthand experience in the industry, and again are building crucial connections with chief pilots, directors of operations, etc. that are getting to witness their work ethic, knowledge, and personality firsthand. In most cases, this leads to preferential hiring.

Some schools just have connections in the right places, too. Horizon, along with several other regionals (I think) has been traveling to UND to interview lately. That's a pretty amazing deal.

FlyJSH

Many 135 jobs are Single Pilot (autopilot in liew of SIC for pax operations). Hauling boxes in a Caravan by oneself still requires someone who will ACT as a PIC not just sit in the left seat. In my experience, companies want someone at or near ATP and who is independent and good enough to run a line without much home office assistance: somebody who can get the job done.

I know of a very few B1900's which HAD an autopilot installed. They were used part 135, SINGLE PILOT. Part 121 REQUIRES two pilots. (please understand my next statement is pragmatic, not intended to be rude) The insurance agents see an SIC on a B1900 flying part 121 as being there to replace an autopilot and to satisfy the FAA.

Single pilot is a different world. Amungst the usual ILS, LOC, LOC BC, VOR, my current employer (an air ambulance company) is authorized for NDB circle to land, contact aproaches, smudge pots/torches in liew of installed runway lights, and even IFR in uncontrolled airspace. It may only be a twin Cessna, but it still takes a Pilot.

JoeyMeatballs

Well in my opinion a college degree in any field is obviously a plus, don't think it matters if it was Riddle, Daniel Webster, etc.... Anybody with the minimum times should be able to get an interview with a regional well before they meet 135 mins. One thing I will say is taht if you go to an aviation school its easeir to get a "feel" for the industry, e.g. internes and other students talking, internships etc.... I went the Normal 4 year school route while Instructing, and learned about the industry as I went. Both are good ways of getting to the airlines just depends whats works for you

CWU1919

kansas was right pretty much. Some of these airlines have relationships and written agreements with some of these 4 year universities and look to these universities to produce a handful of pilots for them depending on their needs because they know what to expect in terms of what they will be getting. For instance where I go if you are a graduate from the flight program as a "flight officer major" with 750 TT, 50 ME you can apply to the Horizon direct hire program that is established with our university. You are then put into a pool and depending on things like your GPA, your behavior and your merit while in the program, you are ranked. Horizon then takes a handful of the top ranked candidates depending on their hiring needs and conducts interviews with these grads. It's part of the university's job to give you the tools to prepare you for the interview and so they ask what Horizon wants and then kind of tailor the program to fit Horizon's needs. Obviously many people choose not to participate in the direct hire program, but all the criteria is there for those who want to pursue it. I've never heard of a 135 that has a formal relationship with a university.
I think you are right in terms of the two pilot thing. 750 TT 50 ME I think is inexperienced for single pilot IFR and they are going to be nervous hiring someone with those hours just coming out of college. Another thing is that you will get all your ratings but after graduating you'll only have between 250-300 hrs and have to get the next several hundred within a small period of time usually instructing to stay qualified for the direct hire program and meet those mins. I just don't think these programs are good at preparing you for single pilot IFR but are much more capable of helping to set the foundation and a small taste of what it's like in the 121 world.

QCappy

Another plus to many of these aviation degrees people get is that they are trained in an "airline style" from day one. Strict procedures, adherence to checklists, etc. Not to say that non-college aviation training is somehow less strict, but the universities usually run their programs similar to an airline's way of doing things.

Just my 2 cents having gone through a university aviation program.

overspeed

The airlines just need warm bodies. If they can't get enough people, they lower the minimums and vice versus. (or however you spell that)

freezingflyboy

Having taught at both small FBOs and a large 141 university program (my screen name should be a clue to which one) I had the oppurtunity to make some obervations. It seems that when it comes to large university programs, a certain amount of it is politics and connections between the university and the airlines. But what seems to be more important than connections is reputation. Thats how new connections are greated. Its not someone cold-calling the airlines, telling them to hire their grads (so remember that and don't walk into an airline with a chip on your shoulder just because you came from a university program). Airlines who have hired past grads from university programs and had success training them and having them on line will tend to remember that and recognize that trend. In addition, the airlines can have some say in how the university programs train students, helping to make the transition to the airline world easier and making it possible to lower minmums for hiring. Basically what it comes down to is this: with pilots coming from a university program the airlines are getting a known quantity. Because there are so many FBOs out there and the quality of training varies greatly, its harder to lower those requirements for hire and still expect a high degree of success when moving into the airline world.

As far as airlines travelling to universities to interview, it just makes economic sense. It is far cheaper to fly 3 or 4 people out to interview 30 or 40 people than it is to do the opposite. Especially when the university encourages such visits by offering to pay for hotels and meals.

fosters

Just curious what ASA found as a discrepancy?

Also wanted to say I feel for ya.