JetBlast77

What would it take to merge all three lists and form our own union? Southwest seems to do pretty well with this. Skywest managment has always been against ALPA, and a lot of us at ASA/XJT are not that fond of ALPA as of late. I think if we put it to a vote, we could get guys to sign off on forming our own union and merging all three lists. I think we will be the strongest if we're all under the same roof. What do you think?

rickair7777

Where do I sign?

samballs

Thats why they won't put it to a vote. They know if they forced the the merge all 3 groups issue then they would be in trouble when a vote came to for IBT, Skywest union, or ALPA.

duvie

I would be for it. The main logistical question would be, would the new ASA vote ALPA out , replacing them with the "SPA," or would SkyWest try to vote "SPA" in then hope ASA would merge with the understanding "SPA" would be the remaining union.

The upside is ALPA would be buying ASA quite a few lunch boxes to try and stay on property.

Blueskies21

I think the issue of forming an inhouse pilot union is you lose all the logistical support that ALPA national provides. So you need your own aeromedical people, you need your own legal, your own lobbying arm, etc etc. The upside is, you don't have any question who's interests the union is pushing. The downside, a lot of extra expense and growing pains of making something new.

JetBlast77

True, but it seems to be working out pretty good over at Southwest. Morale is high, the relationship between pilots and managment is pretty good. I think the initial cost would be more than worth it in the end. As for whether or not the new ASA would approve it....if you told us forming the SPA would be the only way all 3 lists would merge, I'm very confident XJT guys would sign it. Seeing as though we are almost twice the size of ASA, thats all you would need. We are NOT happy with ALPA right now and pretty much everyone I fly with agrees.

clearprop

A journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step. What is step 1 in order to get this balloon floated with the masses? There must be a few pilots with some background in law and labor relations flying the line that could help layout the process.

Nevets

What would it take? Skywest Inc management deciding they want to merge all three groups. Or the NMB declaring single carrier status. Then a representation vote in with a plurality of the pilots voting chose SPA. Just because Skywest votes in ALPA or any other union, does NOT mean the lists will be merged. If Skywest management is against ALPA, maybe ALPA is exactly who we should pick! My guess is that Skywest management is against unions period. What has ALPA national done to make you un-fond of your MEC?

Reference above, just because Skywest votes in a union, it does not mean the list will be merged. If management were to go ahead an merge the pilot groups, or the NMB declares us a single carrier, then you would have a representation vote.

Your MEC represents you, not the mainline MEC. ALPA is no different than CAPA. Its a collection of unions forming an association. You don't see CAPA officers dictating anything to SWAPA or the APA do you?

You could call SWAPA bananas union and guess what? It would be working out pretty good over at Southwest. Now give me an example of where its not working out pretty good and I'll tell you that you can call them SWAPA and it still wouldn't work out pretty good. The morale and relationship between pilots and management depends on the pilots and management, not the name of the union. The pilots make up the union, not the name. What is it that you are not happy with at ALPA that wouldn't be the same if they called themselves SWAPA?

RedeyeAV8r

Nothing against SWAPA but SWA pilots have yet to see or have had to face any real negative issues. (Furloughs, Bankruptcy, Leveraged buyout)
This is a testament to SWA Management and their business model. They have been able to stay profitable.

When an Airline is consistently profitable, this usually means stable growth and growth means everyone moves up and that means everyone is generally happy.

Wait until the Merger with Airtran is complete.

Having been there and done that, an In house Union can work, but generally it will cost more as an In House to provide the benefits a Larger National Union can Provide.

Please do not take this take this the wrong way: but many Regional Carriers represented by ALPA get more bang for their buck than they realize, as the Group A and B carriers pay for or subsidize the smaller carriers.

Not saying ALPA is perfect by a long shot but going it alone as an independent will get expensive. Just saying.

JetBlast77

Its not about what ALPA has done, its about what they haven't done. Its all about the $$ with ALPA and I think deep down we all know that. If Skywest did go ALPA, wouldn't the ALPA merger policy require that all three lists merge? I'm pretty sure it is required in black and white at that point.

I'm pretty sure that all ALPA carriers within a company MUST be on the same list.