The Realization of United Express
02-21-2010, 01:14 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Position: Guru
Posts: 182
I work for XJT and just wanted to comment on my experience the past few months flying as United Express. I think I can speak for all of us when I say it has been shocking to see the type of service and conditions UAL provides to its express carriers. I don't know if it’s common or if Continental has just spoiled us for all these years but this is truly unbelievable. I was doing a walk around the other day and couldn't believe how filthy the aircraft was as I had never seen a plane so dirty before. One of our supervisors informed me that at CAL our planes are washed daily to maintain a clean appearance. I never knew that before, I guess I just always assumed our aircraft didn't get that dirty since we fly higher and faster.
Anyway after this, I went inside to help the flight attendant cross seat belts. I was appalled at how dirty the inside of the plane was. The flight attendant informed me that she was trying to do the best she could but at UAL they don't have cleaners cleaning the inside of the aircraft after every leg like they do at CAL. Again I never realized some airlines don't do this. Finally, I went to the back to use the Lav. It was absolutely appalling. I couldn't believe the smell and condition. Again, I was informed that at UAL, they don't come inside the aircraft after every leg, wipe down the lav, or spray air freshener. I never knew that this wasn't the norm.
Then our flight got underway and I waited for our PDC to come up on my FMS screen. I was then informed by the captain that at UAL, we don't get PDCs and we have to call and get our clearance. After waiting to get a word in for 10 mins I finally called and got the clearance. After we were in flight a while, I decided to send a weather message to get the latest TAF and metar for our destination since it didn't have digital ATIS. I was informed that at UAL, we don't have weather messages and have to rely on our 5 hour old TAFs in the weather packet we received prior to boarding. I couldn't believe it. About 40 mins from arriving, I went to send the in-range report to find out our gate, where the aircraft was going, if it was on time, where we were going, and to let ops know of our specials. Well, you guessed it, no in range reports at UAL, we have to call ops from in the air. This is something I have never done in my almost 5 years here. We have to call ops when we land to tell them we're on the ground? I constantly forget because again, I've never had to do this, it comes up on their computer as soon as we land and they are always there waiting for us. Not at UAL.
Waiting for marshallers to park us? Barely ever seen that, they are almost always waiting for us at the gate with no call required. I am quickly realizing how much extra work some of these other companies have to do in a given day! No wonder you guys are tired! While I realize a lot of this stuff isn't a big deal (with the exception of cleaning the aircraft cuz that’s nasty), it has really opened my eyes to how what we are used to isn't the norm. While I'm happy to get additional flying (but not happy about Mesa guys losing work), I'm really going to have to get used to this. What have your guys experiences been?
Anyway after this, I went inside to help the flight attendant cross seat belts. I was appalled at how dirty the inside of the plane was. The flight attendant informed me that she was trying to do the best she could but at UAL they don't have cleaners cleaning the inside of the aircraft after every leg like they do at CAL. Again I never realized some airlines don't do this. Finally, I went to the back to use the Lav. It was absolutely appalling. I couldn't believe the smell and condition. Again, I was informed that at UAL, they don't come inside the aircraft after every leg, wipe down the lav, or spray air freshener. I never knew that this wasn't the norm.
Then our flight got underway and I waited for our PDC to come up on my FMS screen. I was then informed by the captain that at UAL, we don't get PDCs and we have to call and get our clearance. After waiting to get a word in for 10 mins I finally called and got the clearance. After we were in flight a while, I decided to send a weather message to get the latest TAF and metar for our destination since it didn't have digital ATIS. I was informed that at UAL, we don't have weather messages and have to rely on our 5 hour old TAFs in the weather packet we received prior to boarding. I couldn't believe it. About 40 mins from arriving, I went to send the in-range report to find out our gate, where the aircraft was going, if it was on time, where we were going, and to let ops know of our specials. Well, you guessed it, no in range reports at UAL, we have to call ops from in the air. This is something I have never done in my almost 5 years here. We have to call ops when we land to tell them we're on the ground? I constantly forget because again, I've never had to do this, it comes up on their computer as soon as we land and they are always there waiting for us. Not at UAL.
Waiting for marshallers to park us? Barely ever seen that, they are almost always waiting for us at the gate with no call required. I am quickly realizing how much extra work some of these other companies have to do in a given day! No wonder you guys are tired! While I realize a lot of this stuff isn't a big deal (with the exception of cleaning the aircraft cuz that’s nasty), it has really opened my eyes to how what we are used to isn't the norm. While I'm happy to get additional flying (but not happy about Mesa guys losing work), I'm really going to have to get used to this. What have your guys experiences been?
Your flying out of IAD?
02-21-2010, 01:31 PM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 2,750
wow. Had no idea you guys didn't have that. We have all that stuff at mainline - a whole herd of cleaners every leg, lav service, acars wx and gate info. But why is the wx thing UAL's fault? Don't you have dispatchers? Can't you talk to them enroute? Why doesn't Express jet wash it's own aircraft? Seriously, I don't know how this fee for departure contract works, but is it UAL's job to wash your jet?
As for United's employees not caring....UAL was the number one on time airline in 2009 among the Legacies...even beating the godlike Delta. So I don't buy it.
As for United's employees not caring....UAL was the number one on time airline in 2009 among the Legacies...even beating the godlike Delta. So I don't buy it.
02-21-2010, 01:52 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: E-170
Posts: 842
just wait till you and your captain have to carry a wheel chair passenger down the ramp in IAD because all the rampers are to stupid/dont know english well enough to get a wheel chair. the United ops is a joke. the only place worse is philly cause there your likely to get shot while carrying the wheel chair passenger.
02-21-2010, 01:54 PM
#15
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Position: FO4LIFE
Posts: 1,531
02-21-2010, 01:54 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 7ER B...whatever that means.
Posts: 3,982
Wait! What?! I worked for ExpressJet from Nov 04-Feb 08. I was a EWR FO-IAH FO-EWR CA-ONT CA and the only place I never had to wait for rampers was ONT. It was quite common to wait for rampers in EWR and IAH. Maybe this has changed in the last year or two, but it certainly was common to wait when I worked at XE.
02-21-2010, 02:03 PM
#17
Banned
Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 1,192
wow. Had no idea you guys didn't have that. We have all that stuff at mainline - a whole herd of cleaners every leg, lav service, acars wx and gate info. But why is the wx thing UAL's fault? Don't you have dispatchers? Can't you talk to them enroute? Why doesn't Express jet wash it's own aircraft? Seriously, I don't know how this fee for departure contract works, but is it UAL's job to wash your jet?
As for United's employees not caring....UAL was the number one on time airline in 2009 among the Legacies...even beating the godlike Delta. So I don't buy it.
As for United's employees not caring....UAL was the number one on time airline in 2009 among the Legacies...even beating the godlike Delta. So I don't buy it.
02-21-2010, 02:04 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: CL650
Posts: 238
Several years ago, I used to work for a carrier that flew both United Express and Delta Connection feed.
Two completely different worlds.
What you are witnessing has been going on for years -- United has completely destroyed their brand because for whatever reason they haven't "figured out" that the flying public doesn't differentiate between United "mainline" and United Express. There is zero support for Express -- it's all about contracting with the most "bargain-basement" feeder company and committing the least amount of resources to that endeavor.
Next time you're parked at the "F" gates in ORD, and your praying none of your passengers slips on the long and icy trek out to your plane, take a look across the ramp at the "G" gates and all the Eagle flights boarding with jet-bridges over there. When you do, ask yourself, if you were a member of the flying public, who would you put your money on?? (you'll understand my point when you see what I'm talking about)
United routinely likes to "eat their young." It gets really interesting when they start playing games with departure slots... United dispatch will routinely re-assign EDCT's into slot-restricted airports from United Express flights and give them to Mainline flights in order to "pump" their DOT performance numbers -- even if doing so will delay a United Express flight several additional hours. (to the detriment of those United customers on that Express flight) I sat in Buffalo for 4 additional hours one afternoon because they took our departure slot from us and gave it to a mainline flight departing out of another New York area airport who had a much later slot time. My company took the hit in the DOT "on time" rankings for that trip (and many others like it) while United mainline was able to maintain more "marketable" numbers.
I spent several years on the United Express side of my company when I eventually moved over to the Delta Connection operation. I was shocked at the difference in culture.
I got the impression that Delta mainline had figured out if their regional feeders looked bad, their customers were not happy and it made them look bad - so they did everything they could to make us look good. The amount of support and resources they made available to us was simply phenomenal. As a result, we were able to deliver a top-notch product to their customers.
I sounds like Continental shares a similar philosophy with their feeders ... sorry to hear you're stuck with the disaster United has created with its feed.
Two completely different worlds.
What you are witnessing has been going on for years -- United has completely destroyed their brand because for whatever reason they haven't "figured out" that the flying public doesn't differentiate between United "mainline" and United Express. There is zero support for Express -- it's all about contracting with the most "bargain-basement" feeder company and committing the least amount of resources to that endeavor.
Next time you're parked at the "F" gates in ORD, and your praying none of your passengers slips on the long and icy trek out to your plane, take a look across the ramp at the "G" gates and all the Eagle flights boarding with jet-bridges over there. When you do, ask yourself, if you were a member of the flying public, who would you put your money on?? (you'll understand my point when you see what I'm talking about)
United routinely likes to "eat their young." It gets really interesting when they start playing games with departure slots... United dispatch will routinely re-assign EDCT's into slot-restricted airports from United Express flights and give them to Mainline flights in order to "pump" their DOT performance numbers -- even if doing so will delay a United Express flight several additional hours. (to the detriment of those United customers on that Express flight) I sat in Buffalo for 4 additional hours one afternoon because they took our departure slot from us and gave it to a mainline flight departing out of another New York area airport who had a much later slot time. My company took the hit in the DOT "on time" rankings for that trip (and many others like it) while United mainline was able to maintain more "marketable" numbers.
I spent several years on the United Express side of my company when I eventually moved over to the Delta Connection operation. I was shocked at the difference in culture.
I got the impression that Delta mainline had figured out if their regional feeders looked bad, their customers were not happy and it made them look bad - so they did everything they could to make us look good. The amount of support and resources they made available to us was simply phenomenal. As a result, we were able to deliver a top-notch product to their customers.
I sounds like Continental shares a similar philosophy with their feeders ... sorry to hear you're stuck with the disaster United has created with its feed.
02-21-2010, 02:08 PM
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 7ER B...whatever that means.
Posts: 3,982
By the way its BANKruptcy. As in a combination of the words BANK and CORRUPT.
02-21-2010, 02:11 PM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 7ER B...whatever that means.
Posts: 3,982
Several years ago, I used to work for a carrier that flew both United Express and Delta Connection feed.
Two completely different worlds.
What you are witnessing has been going on for years -- United has completely destroyed their brand because for whatever reason they haven't "figured out" that the flying public doesn't differentiate between United "mainline" and United Express. There is zero support for Express -- it's all about contracting with the most "bargain-basement" feeder company and committing the least amount of resources to that endeavor.
Next time you're parked at the "F" gates in ORD, and your praying none of your passengers slips on the long and icy trek out to your plane, take a look across the ramp at the "G" gates and all the Eagle flights boarding with jet-bridges over there. When you do, ask yourself, if you were a member of the flying public, who would you put your money on?? (you'll understand my point when you see what I'm talking about)
United routinely likes to "eat their young." It gets really interesting when they start playing games with departure slots... United dispatch will routinely re-assign EDCT's into slot-restricted airports from United Express flights and give them to Mainline flights in order to "pump" their DOT performance numbers -- even if doing so will delay a United Express flight several additional hours. (to the detriment of those United customers on that Express flight) I sat in Buffalo for 4 additional hours one afternoon because they took our departure slot from us and gave it to a mainline flight departing out of another New York area airport who had a much later slot time. My company took the hit in the DOT "on time" rankings for that trip (and many others like it) while United mainline was able to maintain more "marketable" numbers.
I spent several years on the United Express side of my company when I eventually moved over to the Delta Connection operation. I was shocked at the difference in culture.
I got the impression that Delta mainline had figured out if their regional feeders looked bad, their customers were not happy and it made them look bad - so they did everything they could to make us look good. The amount of support and resources they made available to us was simply phenomenal. As a result, we were able to deliver a top-notch product to their customers.
I sounds like Continental shares a similar philosophy with their feeders ... sorry to hear you're stuck with the disaster United has created with its feed.
Two completely different worlds.
What you are witnessing has been going on for years -- United has completely destroyed their brand because for whatever reason they haven't "figured out" that the flying public doesn't differentiate between United "mainline" and United Express. There is zero support for Express -- it's all about contracting with the most "bargain-basement" feeder company and committing the least amount of resources to that endeavor.
Next time you're parked at the "F" gates in ORD, and your praying none of your passengers slips on the long and icy trek out to your plane, take a look across the ramp at the "G" gates and all the Eagle flights boarding with jet-bridges over there. When you do, ask yourself, if you were a member of the flying public, who would you put your money on?? (you'll understand my point when you see what I'm talking about)
United routinely likes to "eat their young." It gets really interesting when they start playing games with departure slots... United dispatch will routinely re-assign EDCT's into slot-restricted airports from United Express flights and give them to Mainline flights in order to "pump" their DOT performance numbers -- even if doing so will delay a United Express flight several additional hours. (to the detriment of those United customers on that Express flight) I sat in Buffalo for 4 additional hours one afternoon because they took our departure slot from us and gave it to a mainline flight departing out of another New York area airport who had a much later slot time. My company took the hit in the DOT "on time" rankings for that trip (and many others like it) while United mainline was able to maintain more "marketable" numbers.
I spent several years on the United Express side of my company when I eventually moved over to the Delta Connection operation. I was shocked at the difference in culture.
I got the impression that Delta mainline had figured out if their regional feeders looked bad, their customers were not happy and it made them look bad - so they did everything they could to make us look good. The amount of support and resources they made available to us was simply phenomenal. As a result, we were able to deliver a top-notch product to their customers.
I sounds like Continental shares a similar philosophy with their feeders ... sorry to hear you're stuck with the disaster United has created with its feed.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
