AE/AA merging numbers?
02-01-2010, 09:39 PM
#1
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Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,822
AE/AA merging numbers?
New AMR rumours!
Categories: American Airlines, American Eagle
Though most of what I'm posting is at this point rumor and has been burning the phone lines all weekend in Chicago ... sources that wish to stay nameless will only confirm that there will major changes coming to AA & AE and a major announcement by the end of the month. For AE there was a legal deadline coming up on 18 January in regards to grievances and court cases in connection to pilot issues. It's to confusing here to explain it all. However, prior to the deadline AMR came to the unions with ways to clear the books and set the stage for the future for both AA & AE. Piece things together from all the different sources and you will get a clear picture that AA is looking to create extraordinary changes.
• AA (ALPA) & AE (APA) are close to agreeing and signing (if they have not already done so) to combine both the AE pilots seniority list with the AA pilots seniority list. Creating 1 single seniority list for the pilots between both divisions of AMR. • This agreement would allow AE pilots to cross over into the AA operation when opening occur, while AA pilots could cross over to the AE system in the same manner. Which ever pilot crosses over to the other side would retain company seniority, but enter the other side on the junior scale. But, the restriction to crossing between AA & AE would be gone. • This agreement would remove the past restrictions on the size and "scope" of what aircraft AE operations.
Now hold on your knickers and you'll see why the buzz about blew Chicago apart today.
• AA signs a letter of intent with Bombardier for a large AE order for the new 130 seat CRJ. With the removal of the scope clause it releases AE to fly any aircraft. • AE will have a major expansion as we take over a huge amount of AA domestic flying, while AA decreases their domestic flying. AA will need less F/A's. • AA goes to cross utilization for the F/A's and one reserve pool instead of it's current domestic & international operations. AA would need less F/A's, but AE would need massive numbers. Info is that AA would need between 900-1000 less F/A's, but that AE would need nearly as many to build up their numbers. • AE changing from our current system of attendance to match AA's attendance program, for missed assignments, late calls, sick days, etc. • AA & AE will follow up with the single seniority list for the pilots with 1 single seniority list for the F/A's. • AMR has over 2.5 billion in cash to adds to it's already high cash war chest.
Now, I don't need to tell any of you what this would mean. It means a total and complete alternation the to AA as we know it. The pilots scope clause has always held AMR in check to what they can turn over to AE. But, in settling the outstanding grievances, law suits and removing the scope clause it opens the barn door wide open to what can be changed. Would the future be as Bob Crandall envisioned 25 years ago in that AA would fly international, coast to coast and other select flights while AE took over all of the domestic flying? A combined seniority list for pilots and F/A's would allow the corporation to move people from one side to the other freely.
As I've said most of this had popped up in the last few days as rumor. This all came started when AA went to their separate divisions and said "We've got a deal for you if you agree to one seniority list between AA & AE." Everything else has been in the final stages ever since and pretty good sources will not deny any of what Iv listed other than to say "Look for big announcements and changes by the end of the month."
Maybe I'm only passing on rumor that has kept Chicago tongue tied all weekend, but ... start looking at the way AA is moving. Look at the papers they have filed in Washington, look at their cash on hand, look at the new open skies agreement between the US & Japan, look at the fight between AA / OneWorld and Delta over which way Japan Airlines will move.
Could it all be a move in the game with AA and the unions to force the unions to reduce cost? Yes. But, we all know where money is concerned AMR will do whatever it needs. The one thing that won't change is that the grievances and legal cases between the pilots at AMR and each division are on a fast track to resolution.
I know that anyone in Chicago this past weekend has seen more screaming and yelling on the AA side than we've ever seen. They went ballistic when some of this new was leaked.
"Fasten your seat belts, it's going to be a bumpy ride!"
Categories: American Airlines, American Eagle
Though most of what I'm posting is at this point rumor and has been burning the phone lines all weekend in Chicago ... sources that wish to stay nameless will only confirm that there will major changes coming to AA & AE and a major announcement by the end of the month. For AE there was a legal deadline coming up on 18 January in regards to grievances and court cases in connection to pilot issues. It's to confusing here to explain it all. However, prior to the deadline AMR came to the unions with ways to clear the books and set the stage for the future for both AA & AE. Piece things together from all the different sources and you will get a clear picture that AA is looking to create extraordinary changes.
• AA (ALPA) & AE (APA) are close to agreeing and signing (if they have not already done so) to combine both the AE pilots seniority list with the AA pilots seniority list. Creating 1 single seniority list for the pilots between both divisions of AMR. • This agreement would allow AE pilots to cross over into the AA operation when opening occur, while AA pilots could cross over to the AE system in the same manner. Which ever pilot crosses over to the other side would retain company seniority, but enter the other side on the junior scale. But, the restriction to crossing between AA & AE would be gone. • This agreement would remove the past restrictions on the size and "scope" of what aircraft AE operations.
Now hold on your knickers and you'll see why the buzz about blew Chicago apart today.
• AA signs a letter of intent with Bombardier for a large AE order for the new 130 seat CRJ. With the removal of the scope clause it releases AE to fly any aircraft. • AE will have a major expansion as we take over a huge amount of AA domestic flying, while AA decreases their domestic flying. AA will need less F/A's. • AA goes to cross utilization for the F/A's and one reserve pool instead of it's current domestic & international operations. AA would need less F/A's, but AE would need massive numbers. Info is that AA would need between 900-1000 less F/A's, but that AE would need nearly as many to build up their numbers. • AE changing from our current system of attendance to match AA's attendance program, for missed assignments, late calls, sick days, etc. • AA & AE will follow up with the single seniority list for the pilots with 1 single seniority list for the F/A's. • AMR has over 2.5 billion in cash to adds to it's already high cash war chest.
Now, I don't need to tell any of you what this would mean. It means a total and complete alternation the to AA as we know it. The pilots scope clause has always held AMR in check to what they can turn over to AE. But, in settling the outstanding grievances, law suits and removing the scope clause it opens the barn door wide open to what can be changed. Would the future be as Bob Crandall envisioned 25 years ago in that AA would fly international, coast to coast and other select flights while AE took over all of the domestic flying? A combined seniority list for pilots and F/A's would allow the corporation to move people from one side to the other freely.
As I've said most of this had popped up in the last few days as rumor. This all came started when AA went to their separate divisions and said "We've got a deal for you if you agree to one seniority list between AA & AE." Everything else has been in the final stages ever since and pretty good sources will not deny any of what Iv listed other than to say "Look for big announcements and changes by the end of the month."
Maybe I'm only passing on rumor that has kept Chicago tongue tied all weekend, but ... start looking at the way AA is moving. Look at the papers they have filed in Washington, look at their cash on hand, look at the new open skies agreement between the US & Japan, look at the fight between AA / OneWorld and Delta over which way Japan Airlines will move.
Could it all be a move in the game with AA and the unions to force the unions to reduce cost? Yes. But, we all know where money is concerned AMR will do whatever it needs. The one thing that won't change is that the grievances and legal cases between the pilots at AMR and each division are on a fast track to resolution.
I know that anyone in Chicago this past weekend has seen more screaming and yelling on the AA side than we've ever seen. They went ballistic when some of this new was leaked.
"Fasten your seat belts, it's going to be a bumpy ride!"
02-01-2010, 11:06 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: MD80
Posts: 1,111
• AA signs a letter of intent with Bombardier for a large AE order for the new 130 seat CRJ. With the removal of the scope clause it releases AE to fly any aircraft. • AE will have a major expansion as we take over a huge amount of AA domestic flying, while AA decreases their domestic flying. AA will need less F/A's. • AA goes to cross utilization for the F/A's and one reserve pool instead of it's current domestic & international operations. AA would need less F/A's, but AE would need massive numbers. Info is that AA would need between 900-1000 less F/A's, but that AE would need nearly as many to build up their numbers. • AE changing from our current system of attendance to match AA's attendance program, for missed assignments, late calls, sick days, etc. • AA & AE will follow up with the single seniority list for the pilots with 1 single seniority list for the F/A's. • AMR has over 2.5 billion in cash to adds to it's already high cash war chest
02-01-2010, 11:44 PM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 483
so theoretically speaking, what would happen to all the furloughed AA guys that are senior to people at AE? Wouldn't they then be able to bump the junior guys out?
02-01-2010, 11:59 PM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Capt
Posts: 611
This agreement would allow AE pilots to cross over into the AA operation when opening occur, while AA pilots could cross over to the AE system in the same manner. Which ever pilot crosses over to the other side would retain company seniority, but enter the other side on the junior scale."
Why wouldn't there be a 'merger' daate of hire kind of thing? What ever your senority holds, you hold?
Getting AA F/A's to work a Super 80 doing a 4 leg day is hard enough. Imagine putting a solo/single AA F/A's in an RJ and doing 16 legs in 4 days! That's laughable!
I'm calling BS on this one.
02-02-2010, 12:34 AM
#5
SDQ Base Chief
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: 320 CA
Posts: 5,665
While I wish something could be worked out between the two unions, I will remain skeptical until it actually happens.
02-02-2010, 02:41 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Posts: 490
What board or site did this monstrosity come from? Why would APA cave in to this?
02-02-2010, 04:51 AM
#7
On Reserve
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 24
The union is not caving in. They do not have a choice. The almighty union always loses when the company is willling to shut itself down if concessions are not met.
02-02-2010, 04:57 AM
#8
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Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,822
I figured you guys would get a kick out of this one. It was sent to me, so I'm sharing it with you. It is a rumour. I haven't been to work in 2 1/2 weeks so I have no clue to what is going on 
02-02-2010, 05:32 AM
#9
SDQ Base Chief
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: 320 CA
Posts: 5,665
I heard a variation of this about 2-3 weeks ago on the line from a CA, said announcement would be in mid-Feb. I personally think it is just a cooked up story, and highly doubt this will come true. But I will hold my judgment until the end of Feb.
02-02-2010, 05:40 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: A320 starboard... Arrrr
Posts: 520
Notice the time of the post... I was up drinking then too.
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