Bustin

There's no way to justify that statement. If Skywest had furloughed Skywest pilots, people would claim they're favoring the ASA group. Fact is, one of the companies will have more furloughs than the other. That's reality. They're separate airlines with separate contracts. ASA's Delta stuff got cut, therefore they were forced into a furlough. It really is as simple as that. And while the pilot groups at the two airlines remain separate, one will always perceive the other as being treated better because the circumstances will always be better at one of them. And they are not going to merge as long as one group is union and the other isn't. Also just reality. I just don't buy into that fact that ASA pilots are getting screwed by Skywest when ASA has only improved since the acquisition. Everyone just wants everything these days. This is the era of entitlement.

FlyHigh88

Anyone see the pilot position in the list of available jobs? I dont see it there to be able to apply.

rickair7777

Undoubtedly, but we are talking about SKW poolies, not ASA poolies.

But I believe the ASA pilots has a contractual lock on most of their flying, ie it can't just be transferred willy-nilly to SKW?

Nevets

And that is exactly the point. Inequity by virtue that there are two separate lists. Both groups help make money for the same entity yet there will always be a disparity on who has it better just because management is afraid of unions.

winglets

You are missing the entire point I am trying to make.

I'm sorry if you don't see it, but pilots that fly Skywest paint and ASA paint work for the same company, Skywest. They are all Skywest pilots.

Maybe someday you'll recognize you're being whipsawed.

You know as much as I do that there shouldn't be any SKY poolies as long as their are furloughed Skywest pilots (ASA paint fliers )

Skywest pilots that fly ASA paint around only have a lock on flying that is transferred over to Skywest paint. If the lease expires and they don't renew, they are screwed.

Bustin

I almost completely agree with what you just said. But it's not just management that's afraid of unions. So is the Skywest pilot group. You've got to give them some responsibility for that too.

Do I want the two companies to merge their pilots? Yes I do. Would I prefer Skywest to transfer ASA furloughs into their seniority lists? Of course. But it's just not realistic. It's certainly a better scenario, just not one that can happen in the Skywest Inc. climate. Whether it's right or wrong, good or bad, the fact that one group is union and the other isn't PREVENTS Skywest Inc. from merging them. With regard to the poolies, word from ASA management to the ASA pilot group was that Skywest was offering a few positions to ASA furloughs before deciding to keep it in house (VLA's). They even fast tracked the resumes. It was also mentioned the remainder of the openings were slated for United furloughs per the United contract (if I remember correctly), but I can't confirm any of that. As for the whipsawing... Please give me one example of a work rule or quality of life issue that has gotten worse for either pilot group because of the acquisition. If you know one, I really am interested in hearing it. I think a lot of the perceptions of Skywest's evil intentions with ASA are baseless. It's just natural in this industry to accuse management of sinister intentions no matter what they do.

What about Berkshire Hathaway "paint"? Should the Netjets furloughed pilots be offered transitions to Geico or See's Candy or RC Willey Home Furnishings? I see your point that it's one ownership under one umbrella, but they are still separate companies. Granted the Berkshire companies are not even similar, but the point is same ownership doesn't imply equality among all. It could, if the company chooses for it to. But it doesn't in Skywest Inc's case. And as I've stated before, for union reasons, it can't. When Delta owned ASA, would they have been out of line hiring "poolies" instead of ASA furloughs? Of course not. I admit your views are based on fairness and equality and they're admirable, the logic just doesn't work in this particular case.

Nevets

But it was Skywest management that was also interfering with the last unionizing attempt. And I know of the indoctrination JA personally gives when pilots are hired, especially during union drives. Gives a more literal meaning to "indoc" class. But yes, pilots are always the ones who end up shooting themselves in the foot anyways.

NOTHING prevents them from merging the companies and employee groups. They would gain some synergies and save money on the long run by getting rid of duplicate departments/personnel. The ASA MEC is NOT preventing this to happen. So to say that ASA ALPA is preventing it is disingenuous at best.

The fact that there is always a non-union group to throw at the union group's face in becoming "cost competitive" is whipsaw. Its not a coincidence that many work rules are the same depressed ones. In other words, it will always be difficult for ASA to bargain for better when you have Skywest pilots willing to do it for less.

Theoretically they can just as Skywest can merge both lists. Just as ASA used its own negotiating capital to allow its pilots AND Skywest pilots to bid over with aircraft if they are transferred between corporate lines, Netjets pilots could also spend its negotiating capital to capture that flying within their scope if they so desired.

Bustin

To say there is nothing preventing the merger is fantasy. Your response on the ASA MEC seems hasty and defensive. I never said the ASA MEC was preventing anything. The circumstances of a union vs. non-union pilot group is what prevents the merger. This is not the fault of Skywest Airlines or ASA. It is just the circumstances they are in. Honestly, why do you believe that doesn't present a huge obstacle?

Newty

Are you suggesting that when ASA furloughed, the way it should have been done was to take the hire dates of everyone under the Inc. banner and furlough from that list, thus furloughing mostly Brasilia FO's from Skywest and then bringing ASA RJ fo's over to Skywest and retrain them in the Bro? Is that what you are suggesting should have happened?

rickair7777

I've said as much.

But my opinion of what should be does not stop me from addressing the reality of what actually is.