rickair7777

Post-pinnacle, SKW and most other US operators limited the 700/900 to FL390 to provide a buffer for poorly trained regional pilots.

saab2000

No, but the CRJ-200 feels like it's going fall out of the sky above about FL290. As far as the QHN at 1013, this is standard the world over and it is one of the few areas where I personally believe the US has a superior system. A change of 1 Hectopascal, say 1013 to 1014 is equal to 27 feet. A change of .01 on the inch scale is equal to 10 feet. More precise in the US.

As far as being high, check around. I've seen similar displays of Cessna Citation Xs at FL510.

And another thing.... I have talked to many folks who were at FL410 in the -200 before the FL370 restriction went into place and most of them said it was a bad idea. The margins are very tight there on the -200 and even the brave ones said the airplane just didn't belong up there. My personal record is FL390 before the restriction went into place and the check airman I was flying with (on a ferry flight) said, "Now you've seen it, don't do it again". We stayed on profile the whole time.

BoilerUP

I'm gonna preface this with "I've never had the CRJ-200 to FL410".

That said, I don't see any reason why it would be a "bad idea" provided the aircraft weight/ISA temps allowed for climb and all appropriate climb/cruise speeds were maintained. Doing MCO-DCA one night on the go-home leg we were at FL370, riding a tailwind, doing .81M. Sure we were fairly light but the airplane performed just fine and aerodynamically speaking there's no reason why 4,000ft higher wouldn't be a safe altitude in that plane **IF** the crew did their job.

Then again, that's the rub with everything...now isn't it?

(perhaps taking the CJ to FL450 on every trip over 400nm has me a bit 'meh' about the novelty of flying high)

JDFlyer

I find the comments about the CRJ-200 really interesting, especially from pilots, who have never flown one - or who have never flown one at a high altitude.

I have over 3,500 hours in CRJ-200/700's and I can tell you from personal experience the -200 in not a safe airplane at high altitudes. I have never flown the -900, perhaps TonyWilliams can share his impressions. I don't care what the CRJ salespeople told to regional airline management, or what management at any given regional requires their pilots to do, the -200 airplane is not safe at FL390 and above. Period. It is NOT about lacking pilot skills. It is NOT about inadequate regional airline pilot training.

The airplane simply does not have the performance with any sort of fuel load on board with pax and baggage. In addition there are issues with the aircraft, that in my personal opinion are not totally resolved by operators, the FAA, or Bombardier, when operating the -200 at OATs of -60 C for extended periods of time. As far as I know the -700/900 do not suffer from the same issues at these cold temperatures.

If anybody wants to go rent one by the hour and fly it without pax, or baggage and a light fuel load, in the middle of winter over Fargo, go for it - have fun. Please just make sure you leave your friends and loved ones back on the ground. They don't deserve to take that risk with you.

Rant over.

JetPilotMike

In my 6,000+ hours (thumps chest) in the CRJ-200, I would not say it is unsafe at 40 or 41. I would say you need to have some experience in determining if it is going to make it up there by the mid-30's, so you don't put yourself in a bad situation above 390. That said, I think I made it to 40 one time in 9 years. Unless it is very cold and a lite load, forget about it.

BenFluth216

Got to wonder why they put some of these birds on routes like that. Flew DTW-SLC back in Oct...

FlightAware > Mesaba Airlines D/B/A Northwest Airlink #3515 > 11-Oct-2009 > KDTW-KSLC

Distance was 1416nm. In the air for 4.3 and blocked 5.5, had to kick some people off due to 170kt headwinds.

BoilerUP

All right, let's have a debate!

I have over 1200 hours in CRJ-200s and can tell you from personal experience the -200 does just fine in the mid-30s. Sure it gets its "climb restricted jet" moniker honestly, and you'll never get there at ISA+ shortly after a 53.0k takeoff weight full of pax/bags/gas...but if the aircraft weight is right, ISA temps are favorable, and there is some speed on the wing it'll do just fine.

You have a very valid point there. The -200, like any underwinged/underpowered CL600-series airplane, doesn't like to go high unless conditions are favorable. That said, if conditions *are* favorable (long leg, mid-weights, ISA temps, etc) there's no reason why the airplane cannot be safely operated at higher, more efficient altitudes.

That's the only point I'm trying to make - if a knowledgeable, well-trained flight crew is driving a -200 series stretch Challenger and understands the limitations of the airplanes and basic high-altitude aerodynamics then the airplane can get up there every day and twice on Sunday (although it will take all day Saturday to get there)

Avroman

Mesaba doesn't limit the 900s. I have been at 41 a few times in it. It does just fine if you respect the weights, temps, speed, and turbulence. These aren't Learjets. You can't take off at max weight and climb right on up in any Challenger/CRJ.

saab2000

It's actually a rare day indeed that you can really get much above 350-360 in the CRJ-200. The only real way to do it is to step climb and at about FL300 accelerate to as fast as you can and then use that horizontal speed to inch your way up. I did get up to FL330 this summer to top some weather on the way from PHL-BGR and FL340 a couple times on the way to MKE, but otherwise it's just not happening. And that was as high as she would go and still stay on profile, which is a limitation and not a target in my world.

I'm at over 4000 hours in the CRJ-200 and know it's limitations. What it'll do on paper and what it'll do in reality are two vastly different things. Yeah, a 3-hour flight in ISA+0 and a relatively light airplane you might safely do it. Why anyone would want to is beyond me, but you might safely do it. I've been told the window between overspeed and underspeed is about 15-20 knots at FL410 in the CRJ-200.

BlueMoon

It is not nearly that tight, 80-100 kts.