AirWillie

The beatings will continue until morale improves huh? Until the company sees us as a notch above a janitor as far as our worth, shirts will continue to be dirty and porno mags and news papers will be all over the glare shield. There is nothing more embarrassing than walking with a fellow pilot that is carrying a back pack or a lunch box but it's understandable why they have them out.

colinflyin

Anyone I meet that wants to be a pilot, I tell them not to do it. It's a waste of time and a lot of money, guys that come out of these big aviation schools like Riddle or Western Mich are upwards of 90k in debt. Then to make less than 20k when you get out of training is a slap in the face. But will the pay change; no, because there are people out there like me that will do it cuz they have no choice. However, I love my job and wish I was still flying instead of painting but the industry is so messed up that my airline can't afford to pay me 16k a year. Feels good to vent a lil! ha

FloridaGator

I love the "yawns" on here. Would you yawn if it was your Mother or daughter on this flight? And I think that anyone who is competent would realize that "professionalism" doesn't begin and end with airspeed, as if its an open and shut case that could just as easily happenend anywhere else.
Professionalism begins with education.
First, we need to make it a requirement to obtain an ATP to have a bachelor degree. The regionals are filled with hobbyists that quit their jobs as bank tellers in thier late forties and were coddled both through training and by captains who could safely operate single pilot.
Second, we need to require more than 1500 hours to get an ATP. Perhaps 2000 with 500 multi.
Third, SIC's should be required to be Type rated with an ATP. Non of this Low-rent SIC type rating stuff.

After this, a big political push should be taken up to fix the rest requirements. 12 hour duty days would not be outlandish. 14 would be acceptable.

There is too much rif raf at the regional airlines. Hopefully this is enough Blood Priority to prompt the feds to clean it up.

One day, it would be nice to see each airline be single certificate. That is, all airplanes in a particular paint be operated by the airline and that airlines pilots. Continental pilots have a bargaining issue handed to them to recapture all the flying, 100 percent.

Zapata

In a sense, yes. I'm not talking about hackneyed MP3 player, spiked hair and backpack debate. I'm talking about if we had our equivalent to the AMA, damn right they'd treat us more like professionals. Instead, we have ALPA and the Teamsters.

Zapata

I have my own view of backpacks, but that is beating a dead horse. That said; What in the heck is unprofessional about a frigging lunch box? If I bring lunch from home to work, I put it in a lunch box because, it's just a container for carrying one's lunch. That's why it's called a lunch box.

CaptainNameless

Yes, the crew were not looking at (or registering) their instruments. They screwed up.

The crew was the bullet. But what was the gun, and who pulled back on the hammer and set it ready to fire at innocent passengers?

The entire airline financial system, the subcontracting, RFP-ing, undercutting, whipsawing, pilot-concessioning business system that we all work under now is what PUT that sub-par crew there at the pointy end of the plane that night. A crew who for whatever reasons lost a grasp on the life-and-death laser beam focus that is required to safely maneuver a sophisticated airplane.

Under a better financial business system, such a crew might be far less likely to even have the CHANCE TO BE THERE to fail so tragically.

The system that allowed lives to be placed in such peril bears some deep, deep examination.

AirWillie

Well if you have to use a lunch box because you can't afford to eat, don't bring those colored ones from school that you can spot from the other side of the terminal. Hide it or get one that blends with the flight kit. Have you seen a JAL or Lufthansa crew or British or any other respectable major carrier's pilots with lunch boxes?

btwissel

not every ATP applicant is an airline pilot. there are plenty that are corporate pilots, private pilots, etc., that just want the ATP to fly their plane, lower insurance, personal ego boost, or what-have-you. you're going to deny all of them


you do realize there are two kinds of ATP certificates, SEL and MEL? there's a separate checkride for each

up until Intl. flying required them, the SIC wasn't even needed. and ask your company why they don't just give you the full type on your initial checkout. there's only a couple of items tested that aren't on the SIC ride.

and what ever happened to having a few pilots on the hiring board? used to be that if they had a legitimate issue with the applicant, they tended to not get hired. not enough experience, not hired.

oh, and in general, you've just denied a whole score of military pilots. they tend to come out with ~1000hrs total time. well short of the 2000hrs you suggest. and i bet their experience is, on the whole, more varied than ours (myself definitely included).

Zapata

My my, you're being awfully narrow minded and presumptuous. I cannot afford to eat airport food not because of the price but, because most of it is junk and my commitment to good health can't "afford it". I bring food from home whenever I can because it is healthier.

I assure you that I don't carry a novelty lunch box and it is quite nondescript. However, there is no reason to hide it.

Yes, I have seen "respectable carrier's" pilots with lunch boxes. Given all of the guts I see hangover the beltline, lunch boxes should be seen more often.

Why do you have such inane concerns? There are much bigger fish to fry.

Copperhed51

You've probably never hand flown a 10-leg 16-hour duty day, huh? Boy that autopilot, FMS, and flight attendant are something else. Hard to pay attention to airspeed or anything else when you're falling asleep while you're flying........not that I've ever done that. Pay, rest, commuting, training, and a pilot's record are all contributing factors to not paying attention to airspeed, I guarantee it.