Can regionals survive w/o mainline contract
05-25-2009, 06:12 PM
#31
Banned
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 110
The point with Cape Air is... some regionals don't require that leverage. Allegiant as well. Yes, a start-up. But perhaps also a trend. We will see.
05-25-2009, 06:55 PM
#33
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Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: DD->DH->RU/XE soon to be EV
Posts: 3,732
Part of the market research that went into it discovered that people would GLADLY drive all the way to BWI to take advantage of SW's low fares. As opposed to paying higher fares out of IAD where AA, UAL, and USAir dominate. The NoVa area is huge, and that's a large market of passengers.
The business plan was to capture the flier who drove all the way to BWI and draw them back to IAD with a low cost option. As has been mentioned, when carriers in bankruptcy match fares, it's hard to compete. Add to that the same thing that helped do XJT/Branded operations in, fuel had just about doubled from start up to shut down.
05-25-2009, 07:45 PM
#35
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Joined APC: Apr 2006
Posts: 361
Allegiant and Cape Air are not your typical airline models. Regionals are used to move traffic to a hub then to their connection. Both Allegiant and Cape Air are designed to move passengers to a specific destination and they maximize their revenue through diversifiying the O side of the equation and limiting the D side (whereas most airlines try to maximize both). Allegiant also gains 25% of it's revenue through incidentals, for a time a unique position, that is now trying to be emulated by all with their fees. Allegiant's primary competitor is the regional airline and AAA. Their direct flights are competing against two-leg flights or a 90min drive to the nearest hub of a major.
Any airline, regional or otherwise, can survive on it's own provided it is well managed and marketed. Regionals biggest problem is their lack of marketing and infrastructure as they rely on their major partners to do all the lifting here. This two items require A LOT of startup capital to invest and is a major hurdle to overcome.
06-02-2009, 12:41 PM
#36
Tuk er jerbs!
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: B747 Left
Posts: 1,342
Cape Air is a very small niche outfit operating on a few non-competitive routes. It's irrelevant to compare a C402 prop outfit to a regional jet carrier. In fact it's really incorrect to call some outfits like American Eagle "Regionals." They are major airlines in their own rights and with their low-pay compensation to employees, competing, in many ways, directly with their mainlines.
Let me set you straight: I've flown a jet at a 121 regional, and I currently fly for Cape Air. It's the same job in smaller airplanes. We have 56 C402s and 2 ATR-42s, carried over 650,000 passengers in 2007, have more operations in/out of Boston Logan than any other carrier on a daily basis, and with the exception of the ATRs, do it with "Cape Air" plastered in big letters on the tail.
If you want to get into the "real airline" debate, we win. Not to put down jet regionals in any way (I'm still looking forward to taking recall to XJT if that ever happens), but RJ operators provide feed for a mainline operator. We provide our own transportation under our own name on our own ticket stock. Can Eagle say the same?
06-02-2009, 03:39 PM
#37
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Joined APC: Oct 2008
Position: OH CA - Retired
Posts: 355
Oh my. Someone busting out the old "Cape Air isn't a real airline because they don't fly jets" routine.
Let me set you straight: I've flown a jet at a 121 regional, and I currently fly for Cape Air. It's the same job in smaller airplanes. We have 56 C402s and 2 ATR-42s, carried over 650,000 passengers in 2007, have more operations in/out of Boston Logan than any other carrier on a daily basis, and with the exception of the ATRs, do it with "Cape Air" plastered in big letters on the tail.
If you want to get into the "real airline" debate, we win. Not to put down jet regionals in any way (I'm still looking forward to taking recall to XJT if that ever happens), but RJ operators provide feed for a mainline operator. We provide our own transportation under our own name on our own ticket stock. Can Eagle say the same?
Let me set you straight: I've flown a jet at a 121 regional, and I currently fly for Cape Air. It's the same job in smaller airplanes. We have 56 C402s and 2 ATR-42s, carried over 650,000 passengers in 2007, have more operations in/out of Boston Logan than any other carrier on a daily basis, and with the exception of the ATRs, do it with "Cape Air" plastered in big letters on the tail.
If you want to get into the "real airline" debate, we win. Not to put down jet regionals in any way (I'm still looking forward to taking recall to XJT if that ever happens), but RJ operators provide feed for a mainline operator. We provide our own transportation under our own name on our own ticket stock. Can Eagle say the same?
Cape Air has done what should be done: match the aircraft to the market.
06-02-2009, 06:45 PM
#38
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Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: King Air 200 CA Hawker 800/900 FO
Posts: 810
Oh my. Someone busting out the old "Cape Air isn't a real airline because they don't fly jets" routine.
Let me set you straight: I've flown a jet at a 121 regional, and I currently fly for Cape Air. It's the same job in smaller airplanes. We have 56 C402s and 2 ATR-42s, carried over 650,000 passengers in 2007, have more operations in/out of Boston Logan than any other carrier on a daily basis, and with the exception of the ATRs, do it with "Cape Air" plastered in big letters on the tail.
If you want to get into the "real airline" debate, we win. Not to put down jet regionals in any way (I'm still looking forward to taking recall to XJT if that ever happens), but RJ operators provide feed for a mainline operator. We provide our own transportation under our own name on our own ticket stock. Can Eagle say the same?
Let me set you straight: I've flown a jet at a 121 regional, and I currently fly for Cape Air. It's the same job in smaller airplanes. We have 56 C402s and 2 ATR-42s, carried over 650,000 passengers in 2007, have more operations in/out of Boston Logan than any other carrier on a daily basis, and with the exception of the ATRs, do it with "Cape Air" plastered in big letters on the tail.
If you want to get into the "real airline" debate, we win. Not to put down jet regionals in any way (I'm still looking forward to taking recall to XJT if that ever happens), but RJ operators provide feed for a mainline operator. We provide our own transportation under our own name on our own ticket stock. Can Eagle say the same?
06-03-2009, 06:13 AM
#39
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Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: A320
Posts: 661
People can say what they want, if fuel was where it is today and stayed there, XJT Branded would have worked beautifully. Just look at the numbers in their last quarter. Still losing money? Yes, but look at where the bleeding was. Take fuel prices now and multiply the demand XJT had for fuel at the time.....then, look at their revenue. Bingo, we have a profit. Their load factor was over 80% system wide during the final month of operations. They had barely been going 1 year! That’s a better load factor than Southwest had after their first year (do the research). It’s a shame CAL backed them against a wall.
06-03-2009, 07:59 AM
#40
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Joined APC: May 2009
Position: Square root of the variance and average of the variation
Posts: 1,602
Five to Seven flights a day from Dulles to Lansing, Michigan and just about every airport in upstate NY with seven pax per leg all paying $39 intoductory fares didn't do much for Indy Air either.
I was worried I'd have to pass the hat for de-ice fluid.
Oh, and maybe the fact that a great deal of the CRJ's were not RVSM certified had an affect on the fuel costs as well.
I was worried I'd have to pass the hat for de-ice fluid.
Oh, and maybe the fact that a great deal of the CRJ's were not RVSM certified had an affect on the fuel costs as well.
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