de727ups

"To those with a commercial license in their back pocket and a degree on the wall I say, press on! They have already paid the price of entry. A sound path would be at least to put your cards on the table for a time and see what happens."

Skyhigh 3/14/08

"Given the current state of our profession if I were to be a 19 year old kid today I never would even consider even getting a private license let alone choosing aviation as a profession."

Skyhigh 4/14/08

What a difference a month makes....

SkyHigh

I don't understand what you are getting at. My position is unchanged. If someone has already blown their money on college and pilot licenses then you might as well throw your hat in the ring for a time if nothing more than to say that you did it.

However if you have not even started training yet then save your money and invest it someplace else.

Out side of that the profession has taken a nose dive in the last 30 days. Most likely a new pilot would need to wait a few years for even a chance to apply at most regionals and I don't think it is worth that.

SkyHigh

MDT06

If you wanted to become a pilot for the money, I'm sorry to tell you, but the odds of making it are small in the US. If you want money and also want to fly, look outside the US and you'll find plenty of opportunities. Aviation in this country is. Also, a lot of people say they make money, but only few do. I get to see income tax returns all day, for many years, and I don't see this happening to often. Only doctors, dentist, some lawyers, some MBA (top schools) make over 150K a year and this after many years of work or education. If there is something I learned in my job, people like to lie about their income and they always have a story about it. Some IT guys make over 100k, but live in CA, so they really make about 70k. Life is not easy, money is not free and very few jobs out there will give you a chance of making good money. An airline pilot has a chance of making good money, the key word is chance. One thing is correct, a RN makes good money (average is about 60K ) and school is not too long. If you want to make more as a RN, they go back to school and get a master (over 100K and many hours of overtime)....but like pilots it doesn't happen in the blink of an eye and you will find people who hate it the job as any other job. People like to talk about the ones who are making the money, the good stories and forget that for almost every profession many failed along the way. If you do a career just for the money, you will fall out of love very quick.

gintasr

I agree that you should love your profession, but you should also be happy about the salary and quality of life. In my opinion you need all three. Flying does give me a personal satisfaction but it unfortunatly lack in the other two departments (salary and QOL). One of the major nuesences is that the job is not performance based - that is, you will not get a promotion or a raise for doing a good job (on time arrivals/departure, etc.) so in essence all you are working for is to keep yourself from being laid off. Everything is governed by that damn seniority system.

I'm still new to this 121 business but I must say I'm already looking for a way out. Sure, I'm still young and I can stick it out and the salary is 'ok' for now, but I like to think ahead - someday Id like to buy that nice house, Id like to have a juicy retirement fund, Id like a family and kids, and Id like to put my kids through college... when I think about all that and the current state of the industry, I start to have doubt wether or not this career can provide that.

As far as QOL, the argument is back and forth that you get more days off than an average Joe per month, but I'd still prefer to be home every night, in my bed, and with my family rather than in a sleezy hotel or bar.

It's good if you can make it in the industry, but by then you'll probably be a grumpy and lonely old man that has a good story to tell at the bar but most likely lacks a family, a retirement, and a normal life.

To each his own. Flame on.

johnso29

DING!DING!DING! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

cfii2007

Good points........

WhizWheel

The grass is always greener........usually where the dogs have s*@#. I have a TON of really good friends that I went to college with all of whom are in various industries (computers, graphic design, sports, politics, medicine, law) and EVERY one of them has a major complaint and all said if given the opportunity to do something else they would consider it. Everybody thinks that everybody else has it better. Its just not the case.

HercDriver130

Very few jobs or careers ( or even the self employeed ) have it "all".... great money....love their job... and great QOL.......I have been in and out of this business a couple of times...plus flew in the military. On top of that I have been self-employed, worked for someone else ( outside of aviation ) and owned my own business with several employees and I can tell you ......that NONE of them provided "everything".......I am sure there are some ( skyhigh we all know is living the good life....great for him ) who get 10's in all three areas.... but most of us in life will have to find some balance of the three. A balance that is most likely different for everyone. And hell the balance is always changing for most of us.

There is NO doubt in my mind that this "lifestyle" is NOT for everyone. And believe me when I say it is more of a lifestyle that a job. Some flourish....some do not. Every profession is fraught with some peril or danger of losing ones job. And this business is no different..and yes I would say maybe even more so in aviation.

YES... the business has changed... and it will continue to do so. Many great people have lost their jobs in the past week or two. ( Many did in other professions as well by the way ). The reality is... this is a boom and bust business that has hired and fired.. and furloughed people throughout its history and will into the foreseeable future.

Good Luck to everyone.

p.s. as a point...... my wife has a great job with great benefits with a great company making EXCELLENT money in the IT field....she is well compensated for her 24 years of experience...guess what......she HATES the work... and like said above...given the opportunity would jump ship with money as no concern. go figure.

MD11

I get tired too... But only after I had spent all night changing an engine on a 737 and then watched as the crew flew it away. I also get tired of flying an ILS down to mins in a tri-jet level "D" sim and then not be able to go do it in the real thing. I also get tired of giving technical (via satcom) advice to flight crews winging their way to HKG while I sit in a windowless office.
I have weighed all of the pros and cons of flying for a commuter and the pros far exceed the cons.
Recently, I was giving dual to an orthapedic surgeon and he had made his mind up to pursue an aviation career full time. This individual earned over 300k/yr and was prepared to take a massive pay cut with the full knowledge that he may never make that amount again. By the way, we were flying his shiny Diamond w/ MFD and downlink wx. Obviously toys like that are not enough to keep him in his current profession.
My point is to reinforce that age old adage "Do what your heart leads you to". If you are truly tired flying and not just in a temporary funk, then you probably should get out of the business. Hopefully you can find what really trips your trigger.
I notice that guys like "Tony Montana" and "Skyhigh" frequent this site and post much. Their heart is with aviation I think. In fact, I appreciate Skyhigh's point of view and believe he is a true friend of aviation. I would give him a job flying if I had the power to do that.

johnso29

Six of the eighteen guys in my class alone were under 29. The oldest was 38. But, that was just my class.