p1ayn

Does SWA have you sign a training contract? .......Didn't think so. Type rating is your's to keep.
Im done

flyduke

I appreciate the well-thought out comments that have been made in response to my original post. Just a couple of follow-up points:

• The posting on the Lynx contract was AFTER this all happened. It was posted by someone I met in this experience who has been very courteous.

• My call to Lynx was professional, courteous and conversational. Keep in mind that when I called Lynx it was in response to my being surprised with the training contract. When I made the call I had the FULL INTENTION of going to work there and it would have been stupid to be anything but friendly. My goal was to be there for many years as I believe in the route structure and the Q400. I still wish they had just realized I was new to the industry and asking a question based on my experience to date. I wanted to be there.

• I agree if you sign a contract it is a contract. A company might use a contract as a device to keep employees and manage training cost. I also believe that with each month anyone works under a contract they deliver a return of the training cost to tht company, something Lynx does not believe in. They believe that you “owe” them the same on day 1 as day 365. What do you think?

• As for being foolish to cancel the other interviews, yes. I am an honest person and didn’t see any reason not to be excited about Lynx and believe I was going there. . I have no issues with my drug screen or background check.

A training contract is a funny thing. I have an ATP and 2 jet types, all paid for by me and picked by me. As for the 737 type that SWA requires, it’s not a contract but a required asset. Just the same as buying suits for a sales job albeit more expensive.

I learned today that only very recent pilots hired have a contract, There are 12 of them and I have never met any of them. There is no way for anyone to know about the contract unless Lynx was forthright about the issue. If it had been explained in the group presentation perhaps several questions would have come up that they did not want to face. Instead, they surreptitiously sent it individually.

This response was sent from the Lynx Chief Pilot to their pilot board today:

To Captain FXXXXXXX,

I was not involved in the pre-interview presentation, but I've since learned that the information regarding training contracts was not presented. This was not intentional. We have had training contracts in place for the last three classes and will continue to make this a requirement of employment.

There is no intention of hiding the fact that we require a commitment in consideration of the training provided. Should we have been more diligent, certainly, but it was not intended that this go undisclosed.

As far as the individual is concerned, an internal decision was made to withdraw the offer. Please accept my sincere apologies for this situation.

XXXXX

XXXXXX
Chief Pilot -
Lynx Aviation

The original post wasn’t whining. It was a warning to other on this board about the potholes and challanges many of us “newbie’s” don’t know are out there and how not to handle them. I still hope to be "on line" somewhere soon.....

WhiteH2O

Nevermind.

p1ayn

You are correct that I do not personally agree with training contracts, amazing you did understand that concept.
As for what you think of my responses, really dont care, been flying for 19 years and have some knowledge, but of course again, this was just my opinion to the original post.
So with that, I read that flyduke gathered the info, and whole heartly agree and him/her the best.

VTcharter

If you sign a contract at a carrier, they train and type you at thier expense and you can take that type and experience with you when you leave. The pay for your type thing seems to be pretty much the same animal to me, except worse because you actually have to take money out of your pocket where the training contract people just have to stay for a year. (depending on the contract) Either way, you are paying something for you training...one person is paying money and the other is paying time.

VT

Bill Lumberg

Lynx has got to be one of the worst choices out there at the moment. Unless you need to live in Denver for family reasons, I would go elsewhere. Super low pay for a 70+ seat aircraft. Boring routes - how long before you become bored with your 6-7 destinations? Better regionals offering better routes and nicer airplanes are out there. Seriously, the fact that you didn't ask about a training bond is a red flag too - they are becoming more common.

Just find another regional that offers better routes, aircraft and pay and you should be OK. Lynx is not the best operator out there by a long shot.

G2TT

You've obviously never flown a dash. Just because it has props doesn't make it undesirable. As far as the pay...that's another story.

Radials Rule

I agree. There is absolutely no relation, analogously, conceptually or otherwise, between having to pay for your 737 type rating and a training contract. They're completely different and not even in the same ballpark.

Radials Rule

Who says that you'd necessarily get a type rating? Perhaps at a fractional but new hire FO's at regional airlines, ala Lynx, are not getting a type with their training contract.

I know a guy that got on with SWA and bought his type. Within a few months, he was interviewed and hired by UPS and left. So, having to pay for a 737 type doesn't necessarily keep you around.

FlyHappy

You guys are exactly the types I'm talking about. I just have to laugh that you think signing a training contract is the end of the world but it's perfectly acceptable in your logic to spend your own money to get a type rating.

A training contract costs you nothing as long as you fulfill its terms, plus in order to make them at least quasi-enforceable, most involve you receiving a type rating as part of the deal. So at the end of that, no only does it not cost you anything, you are being paid while you're there and when you leave, you walk away with a type rating PLUS considerable experience and flying hours in the airplane -- all of which you "take with you."

Do you guys realize that buying a type rating does nothing for you unless you're trying to get on with someplace like Southwest that requires one? Say you buy your 737 type and don't get hired by SWA -- guess what, no one else will even consider that a valid type rating since you have no time in the airplane. If you look at some of the applications out there, some places will only allow you to list type ratings if you have a certain amount of time in the airplane.

So all you're done is prove my point with your flawed logic. If you hate training contracts, then you should also be against spending big bucks on an otherwise useless type rating that will only be a benefit IF you are hired by SWA. Instead, you tell everyone to NEVER sign a training contract, but it's okay to buy a type rating that will only help your application with ONE company. Just so you don't misunderstand my position on this, if SWA is your goal, then by all means go get your 737 type -- I have no problem with people doing their homework and then making smart decisions to reach their personal goals. What I don't like is others thinking they are the self-appointed Aviation Police and telling others what they MUST or MUST NOT do without knowing anything about someone's personal situation or ultimate career goals.

I keep seeing all kinds of activity on here on Republic threads and keep running into people who think that's the best place to go right now. However, looking at their info on this site, they make you sign a TWO year training contract. So why is everyone interested in them if ALL training contracts are nothing but evil?

Once again, my point is for people looking at "advice" to consider the logic of these people screaming about training contracts. These are the same people who would have passed up jobs at NetJets a few years ago. Instead, the ones who went there are now captains making over $100k/year. Instead of having a "never sign a training contract," a better approach is to look at the company and determine if it's a place worth working at. If it's a decent company, you should have no problem staying there a year. If it's not a good company, then don't go there to begin with! Ultimately, it is YOUR career and YOU have to determine what is the best course of action for YOU, not what some self-appointed Aviation Cop tells you to do. Life is too short and this industry is too nuts to be miserable about everything all the time!