C172MQI

Just wondering if anyone has ever gotten flak from operations, management, whomever, for deciding to divert, hold awhile for t-storms to pass (even though getting is may have been possible, but dicey), the list goes on...

If a Captain is "too conservative" will the C.P. give them a call?

Just wondering how all of this works generally. You always here about pressure in 135 cargo ops but wondering if it happens in 121.

Thanks.
MQI

The Juice

Many decisions such as diverting will be done in conjunction with dispatch, opps and the flight crew...usually not just the CA's decision. Other things as you mention, holding and such, are the CA's call and they do not get too much hastle about it, unless it is way too cautious. Example would be eveyone and their mother is shooting approaches into an airport with bad weather but one crew wants to hold.

The truth about line flying, as many of you know, is if you can land you will. If you can get through the line of storms, you will.

rickair7777

It rarely happens in 121, and if it did they wouldn't push you very hard because they really wouldn't their POI to get the idea that they were pressuring a lot of pilots.

About the only way you could get in trouble would be if you were ignorant of your OPSPECS and based your decision on that. As long as you know the applicable rule or minimums, you have some discretion to avoid situation which are technically, but barely, legal, or a combination of several barely legal circumstances...

Example: Wx at ILS mins by itself would not be an excuse to divert, but if you had a 20 Kt X-wind, snow, and marginal (or missing) braking reports...that combination would get you off the hook.

However, unlike GA, you can't establish "personnel minimums" which are higher than company mins.

PinnacleFO

I diverted last month and then told the dispatcher i was going to sit at our alternate until it got better and then we left and i havent heard anything since.

viper548

usually when you divert for weather it is an obvious decision such as the vis below mins or strong thunderstorms in the area. Like rickair said, if your airplane's x-wind limitation is 30kts, so is yours

paxhauler85

Often times, the decision of where to divert to involves more people than the two people up front. At least in my experience, the dispatcher talks to the original destination station, and planning to decide where the best place would be to send the airplane, crew and pax.

After that, they come to the crew to see if we have the gas and weather needed to reach that airport legally.

EX/ Enroute to Gunnison, shot approach once, no joy. Told dispatch to begin working on PLAN B while we shot another approach. No joy, began holding. Got SELCAL'ed shortly there after with new destination of Montrose, even though the original alternate was Denver. Apparently getting busses to Gunnison for the pax was easier from there, and thats where we were supposed to overnight.

Got there, went to the hotel, new crew showed up an hour later and started their day on time.

This type of intelligent decision making doesn't always happen. This was just one good example.

UnlimitedAkro

When it comes to holding for weather, there is no messing around. When you hit your bingo fuel, you are diverting- End of story. I have seen too many guys with close calls where if they didnt declare emergencies to get immediate priority they would have run out of gas.

shackone

Depends on the airline culture. While airline Captains tend to think of themselves as being 'in charge', this isn't always the case.

But when the chips go down, the Feds don't really care about culture...they care about effective action. In the end, the Captain should make the call. If he can't or won't, then he's just a FO flying from the left seat.

I always saw dispatch as folks whom I would advise of what I was going to do...and then let them tell me why that may or may not be a good idea. Time permitting, of course. Dispatch has more timely info available than we do in the cockpit, so I wouldn't want to leave them out of the loop...but the decision was mine to make.

Yes, I have made such decisions. No, I never heard from management about making them. TWA was a true Captain's airline.

Spooled

It amazes me what 'Captains Authority' means now-a-days.

If the captain says jump, you should say how high.

III Corps

The decision to divert begins long before the actual event. A wise flier figures out some way to notify dispatch of his/her choice of divert points and then lets them suggest yea or nay. This begins the process so everyone has some input while also having a way out.

Example.. you begin checking wx at destination and it is going to poop. Look around at what you need to have do depart holding with to get to an alternate. Then inform dispatch of what you are thinking. They may decide on some other airfield because of re-routes, transportation or whatever but you are working the system.

One thing.. do not make a decision and then waffle. It is a recipe for trouble. IF you decide you are going to divert with x fuel, when you get down to that fuel, DIVERT. The trap is to keep waiting a few more minutes hoping the destination will open and also just after you turn to divert, your destination opens. WRONG... I have seen too many cases where you just move up to the next fix, the destination goes back down and now you are even lower on fuel and have less options.

Decision making begins on the ground and then in the air, you just have to implement them.