What would you do?
06-12-2007, 03:54 AM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Popsicle Logic
Posts: 633
Wow! Everyone had fun last night.
Take a delaying vector and run the checklist.
Here is why:
-According to the information given, the engine fire is out. If the fire persisted the loops should detect a fire and the other bottle could be dispensed. Assuming a CRJ, the pylon will break off and give some redneck a new lawn ornament.
-Smoke in the cargo is a little more automated. Again assuming a CRJ, the first bottle will dispense completely, while the second bottle will time release for 45 minutes.
-Fire detection in the lav is completely automated. Nothing you can do besides have the FA ready with the halon bottle and a PBE. However, she probably has other important tasks.
A flaps 0 approach and landing is not difficult by itself, but it does change how you have to fly. Vref increases and therefore increases the landing distance. With an increased roll-out you may create more problems while using a shorter runway.
I would take 4 left turns and run the checklist and brief the crew.
Take a delaying vector and run the checklist.
Here is why:
-According to the information given, the engine fire is out. If the fire persisted the loops should detect a fire and the other bottle could be dispensed. Assuming a CRJ, the pylon will break off and give some redneck a new lawn ornament.
-Smoke in the cargo is a little more automated. Again assuming a CRJ, the first bottle will dispense completely, while the second bottle will time release for 45 minutes.
-Fire detection in the lav is completely automated. Nothing you can do besides have the FA ready with the halon bottle and a PBE. However, she probably has other important tasks.
A flaps 0 approach and landing is not difficult by itself, but it does change how you have to fly. Vref increases and therefore increases the landing distance. With an increased roll-out you may create more problems while using a shorter runway.
I would take 4 left turns and run the checklist and brief the crew.
06-12-2007, 04:18 AM
#43
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: FDX A300 CPT
Posts: 967
You've shut down the left engine because it was on fire. You ask for vectors to the nearest suitable airport, and about that time, smoke is detected in the cargo compartment. You activate the extinguisher and run that checklist. Shortly thereafter, you get a lav smoke indcation. You notify the flight attendant, run that checklist, and the FA comes back and says yes, there is smoke in the lav, but she doesn't see any fire.
Cleared for the approach, glideslope is alive, call for flaps 15. They don't move.
Do you:
A) Abort the approach and run the flap fault checklist
B) Continue the approach estimating your speeds
My instructor and I disagreed on this one today. I'm just curious what some other pilots would do.
Cleared for the approach, glideslope is alive, call for flaps 15. They don't move.
Do you:
A) Abort the approach and run the flap fault checklist
B) Continue the approach estimating your speeds
My instructor and I disagreed on this one today. I'm just curious what some other pilots would do.
The flight
Flight SR-111 departed JFK at 20:18 (EDT) with 215 passengers, 2 pilots and 12 flight attendants en route to Geneva. At 22:10 Atlantic Time, cruising at FL330, or 33,000 feet (about 10,060 m), the flight crew Captain Urs Zimmermann and First Officer Stephan Loew, smelled an odour in the cockpit and determined it to be smoke in the air conditioning system. Four minutes later, the smoke was visible and the pilots began considering a diversion to a nearby airport for the purpose of a quick landing. At 22:14 AT the flight crew made a "pan-pan" radio call, indicating that an emergency exists but there is no immediate danger to the aircraft, and requested a diversion to Boston's Logan International Airport (300 nautical miles away), but was instead directed to the closer Halifax International Airport in Enfield, Nova Scotia, 66 nm (104 km) away. The crew then put on their oxygen masks and began descending.
At 22:19 AT the plane was 30 nautical miles away from Halifax airport, but required more time to descend from its current altitude of 21,000 feet. At 22:20 AT the crew informed ATC that it needed to dump fuel, and was subsequently diverted away from the airport. Dumping the fuel caused the power of the recirculating fans to shut off, causing the fire to spread back into the cockpit. At 22:24 AT, the crew declared an emergency. Aircraft systems, such as lighting, flight instruments, and the autopilot began to fail and as a result the crew slowly lost any means of successfully flying the aircraft. According to readings from seismographic recorders in Halifax and Moncton, the aircraft struck the ocean at 22:31 AT.[6] The crash location was approximately 44°24′33″N, 63°58′25″WCoordinates: 44°24′33″N, 63°58′25″W, with 300 metres' uncertainty.[7]
smoke,fire???...i'm on the ground!
06-12-2007, 06:40 AM
#44
Banned
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: A-320
Posts: 6,929
Wow! Everyone had fun last night.
Take a delaying vector and run the checklist.
Here is why:
-According to the information given, the engine fire is out. If the fire persisted the loops should detect a fire and the other bottle could be dispensed. Assuming a CRJ, the pylon will break off and give some redneck a new lawn ornament.
-Smoke in the cargo is a little more automated. Again assuming a CRJ, the first bottle will dispense completely, while the second bottle will time release for 45 minutes.
-Fire detection in the lav is completely automated. Nothing you can do besides have the FA ready with the halon bottle and a PBE. However, she probably has other important tasks.
A flaps 0 approach and landing is not difficult by itself, but it does change how you have to fly. Vref increases and therefore increases the landing distance. With an increased roll-out you may create more problems while using a shorter runway.
I would take 4 left turns and run the checklist and brief the crew.
Take a delaying vector and run the checklist.
Here is why:
-According to the information given, the engine fire is out. If the fire persisted the loops should detect a fire and the other bottle could be dispensed. Assuming a CRJ, the pylon will break off and give some redneck a new lawn ornament.
-Smoke in the cargo is a little more automated. Again assuming a CRJ, the first bottle will dispense completely, while the second bottle will time release for 45 minutes.
-Fire detection in the lav is completely automated. Nothing you can do besides have the FA ready with the halon bottle and a PBE. However, she probably has other important tasks.
A flaps 0 approach and landing is not difficult by itself, but it does change how you have to fly. Vref increases and therefore increases the landing distance. With an increased roll-out you may create more problems while using a shorter runway.
I would take 4 left turns and run the checklist and brief the crew.
thats kinda funny, it doesn't matter............ unless you have weak rudder skills
06-12-2007, 06:59 AM
#45
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 348
Thank you to everyone who actually gave some input on the subject though.
Someone had asked what kind of training this is - it's initial 121 training. I have heard from several people that they are not supposed to compound failures like this. I may have a chat with the director of training just to see if this sort of stuff is what they want, or if he's taking it too far. I'm going to wait until I get through the PC first, though. I don't want to become a target.
06-12-2007, 07:08 AM
#46
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,857
Someone had asked what kind of training this is - it's initial 121 training. I have heard from several people that they are not supposed to compound failures like this. I may have a chat with the director of training just to see if this sort of stuff is what they want, or if he's taking it too far. I'm going to wait until I get through the PC first, though. I don't want to become a target.
06-12-2007, 07:11 AM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 348
06-12-2007, 07:14 AM
#48
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Looking Forward
Posts: 253
I have heard from several people that they are not supposed to compound failures like this. I may have a chat with the director of training just to see if this sort of stuff is what they want, or if he's taking it too far. I'm going to wait until I get through the PC first, though. I don't want to become a target.
I believe the compounded failure limit is usually for checkrides only. During a regular sim session everything should be fair game. Why not experience a really really bad day in the sim? That way when you have a regular bad day on line it's not the worst you've seen. Not only is having multiple failures an exercise in running checklists, but also in CRM and decision making.
