Question about pay
06-04-2007, 12:03 PM
#1
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: King Air 200
Posts: 73
Question about pay
Ok, so I fly Part 135 for a living, but have been lurking here in the 121 area keeping an eye on a potential career move (always looking for better pay & QOL). I've seen quite a few posts indicating that flying for a regional can be lucrative if you can get past the first few years as an fo, but after looking through the pay scale tables, I don't see how that works out ... unless you fly quite a few more hours than the guarantee.
So, for those of you who are living the 121 dream, what's the pay and how many hours are you flying to get it?
As an FYI, for those of you who have never flown Part 135, I get paid by the day. Most of my trips are out and back the same day, but if I have to stay over night, I get paid extra. My expenses are covered as well. Other 135 operators may pay differently (e.g. by the mile). The pay is good, but as I fly corporate charter (on-demand), I never know what trips I may have from day to day. Some weeks I may fly 2 days and other weeks I might have 6 days worth of trips.
So, for those of you who are living the 121 dream, what's the pay and how many hours are you flying to get it?
As an FYI, for those of you who have never flown Part 135, I get paid by the day. Most of my trips are out and back the same day, but if I have to stay over night, I get paid extra. My expenses are covered as well. Other 135 operators may pay differently (e.g. by the mile). The pay is good, but as I fly corporate charter (on-demand), I never know what trips I may have from day to day. Some weeks I may fly 2 days and other weeks I might have 6 days worth of trips.
06-04-2007, 12:25 PM
#3
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,041
You're perceptive...looking at a regionals hourly payscale alone is a sure way to get a dangerous misunderstanding or reality. For example the mesa payscale is pretty decent for senior captains...on paper anyway.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied...
Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours).
A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin').
Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200
In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year.
Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more).
That all adds up to about $79K.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied...
Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours).
A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin').
Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200
In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year.
Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more).
That all adds up to about $79K.
06-04-2007, 12:33 PM
#4
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: King Air 200
Posts: 73
If it's the latter, and you're an fo for 3 years or more before making ca, you would then have another 3 years to go as ca ... with a grand total of 6 years or more invested to get to 60k?
06-04-2007, 12:43 PM
#6
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: King Air 200
Posts: 73
You're perceptive...looking at a regionals hourly payscale alone is a sure way to get a dangerous misunderstanding or reality. For example the mesa payscale is pretty decent for senior captains...on paper anyway.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied...
Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours).
A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin').
Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200
In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year.
Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more).
That all adds up to about $79K.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied...
Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours).
A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin').
Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200
In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year.
Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more).
That all adds up to about $79K.
06-04-2007, 12:56 PM
#8
Line Holder
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: King Air 200
Posts: 73
Not complaining, just trying to put a career path together.
06-04-2007, 01:05 PM
#9
Just happy to be here
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Position: 777 FO
Posts: 163
Is that making 60k after 3 years total with the airline (assuming you make ca in the first 3 years) or is it making 60k 3 years after making ca?
If it's the latter, and you're an fo for 3 years or more before making ca, you would then have another 3 years to go as ca ... with a grand total of 6 years or more invested to get to 60k?
If it's the latter, and you're an fo for 3 years or more before making ca, you would then have another 3 years to go as ca ... with a grand total of 6 years or more invested to get to 60k?
No, it doesn't work that way. If you are an FO for an airline for 3 years, you are on 4 year FO pay. If you then upgrade to captain in the same year, you are now on 4 year CA pay.
So, you are a 3 year CA once you start your 3rd year of service with the company, i.e. after completing two years of service.
Confusing?
06-04-2007, 01:09 PM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 222
No, you misinterpret the payscale. Say you are a 3rd year FO. You upgrade to CA and you start at the 3rd year pay for CAs. In other words, the "years", is total years employed as a pilot and is not reset when you upgrade.
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