premier159

I cant believe the DTW 900 CA went as junior as it did!

tom14cat14

thanks guys i am still glad i am on the 200 because i am in msp. that was the most important. QOL is more important to me the upgradeing fast plus if i get the few weeks between sims i hope to take they time off and enjoy it because i will not get it for awhile. thanks again

sigep_nm

For all of you out there dying to get to MSP remember that is the most senior base, but strangest of all we have the worst schedules, the worst credit lines, and the worst airports to fly into. Unless it would cause you to have a two leg commute or to actually commute in the first place, you may find a better career of flying in DTW. As a side note, unless the seat locks come off of the 150+ captains that recently upgraded, the Saab in all likelyhood might not be the aircraft that you upgrade into. However if you do upgrade in the 900 be prepared for to watch you bidding number get worse every month as more senior people to you take it as well. If the seat locks come off 11 days off is all you are going to see for the next two years.

CloudPilot57

Confused.. What does seat locks have to do with days off? Could you explain a little more about having a better career in DTW? I am a new hire and all this is new as I decide if MEM or DTW would be better. (If I have an option)

Thanks

evh347

This is how it worked out for my group of -200 FOs hired late October...

-1 week of Indoc followed by a written test. Form study groups and study often! Your instructor should clue you in on important stuff. The hardest stuff is the 3585 and duty time stuff.
-7 days of Gen. Subjects (2 days of CRM) followed by a written test. Your captains will have joined you at this point and they're required to take the same test. Again, study groups are helpful. Ask for clarifications and study hard. More 3585 and duty time and TLR stuff to study.
-7 days of CBT systems training. No test...each module ended in an online multiple choice test which you would take until you passed. This is the easiest thing to get through, but make sure you ask questions because this will prepare you for FTD/SIM. Use this time wisely.

Eventually, you get paired with a captain during CBT training. There were SIM schedules posted and the captains bid on the available schedules based on their seniority. Your captain/FO pairings were based on age.....oldest FO with highest seniority captain. My pairing resulted in two weeks off before reporting to Denver.

-5 sessions (4 hours each) of systems integration with a FTD (touch sensitive computer screens).
-8 (4 hour) SIM sessions in a full-motion FTD device
-Oral (2 hours individually or 4 hours as a team w/ your captain). The Oral test was easy, but only because we over-studied. They ask questions about every button on the overhead panel, weight & balance, TLR's, and the walk-around. All of this is well-within your capabilities is your focus is to pass.
-2 PC (proficiency checkrides), one day (4 hours) is for your captain and the other day is for you.
-1 LOFT (line oriented flight training = ~6 hours) which is just a "fun" flight and no pressure designed to give you the flavor of actual line flying.

The schedules for the SIM sessions are posted on schedules at the CAE training center in Denver in a couple locations and they can be different from what you initially see on the schedules given to you during CBT training. Each FTD/SIM training session is predicated with an hour "pre-brief" and an hour "de-brief"...so you should report an hour before any scheduled FTD/SIM session. Even when you're here...you should be prepared to receive phone calls from the training center providing updates to your schedule based on the availability of instructors.

We've had nearly a different instructor for every day of FTD/SIM training. That's good and bad. One thing I can say is that the majority of the instructors have been great to work with. They really do everything they can to ensure you are ready. We have our checkrides starting with my captain tomorrow and I'm very confident. Everything didn't really start clicking until SIM #5 and this is coming from a 650TT FO/pilot.

In total, is was 3 weeks of Ground followed up with 3 weeks of FTD/SIM with a 2-week break in between. My advice...during Indoc...focus on Indoc. During General Subjects...focus on that. At Systems, start memorizing "flows" and read over subjects covered on that day later in your hotel room. Before you report to your first sessions of FTD, you need to know your "flows" down cold and start working on "callouts". You must know your "callouts" before your first SIM session. The guys who have had the most success (thusfar) have followed that strategy.

We were told to expect IOE within 3-4 weeks. Basically, we were told to expect a phone call from the scheduling department 2-3 days prior to our IOE.

Good luck.

evh347

Also, I don't follow that philosophy that the low-time FOs were being awarded the jet. That may have been the case, but there were 300+ time FOs in our Gen. Subjects class in October that were awarded the Saab. So, I'm not sure what criteria they use to assign people. I know that I specified my interest in MSP at the time I input my resume.

overspeed

The philosophy is a low-time FO in the jet would not be elligible for the upgrade anytime soon, so therefore would not get bypass captain pay. Don't think for a second that they would place people in one plane over the other for anything other than MONEY reasons.

seattlepilot

Are the interviews for the Jan 14th class done yet? I was hoping to get a call for it but from the sounds of it, it may not happen.. Also, since Jan 14 looks like to be all CRJ people, does that mean that they will save a high time guy like me for a Saab class?

Thanks..

Andrew_VT

I remember hearing the instructors talking about how they were trying to change the selection process so that guys like you (1600TT +200ME) would end up on the Saab so thats very much a possibility.

IHateMgmt

I think Sigep_nm was referring to the new hire CR9 Captains, not FO's. Jet CA's have historically been a 7-10 year upgrade at XJ (with the exception of when the AVRO's first arrived and we were all in the same situation), so the fact that its now down to less than a year for the 900 seems like an anomaly right now. So, assuming the upgrade time in the 900 gets closer to "normal" those ultra junior guys will continue to be the most junior 900 CA as pilots who are overall more senior to you take the 900 upgrade. In this scenario, you would be on straight reserve for the foreseeable future (straight reserve schedules are 11 days off at XJ).

JR shot down the decreased seat lock request from ALPA almost immediately. So I wouldn't be holding your breath for that to change anytime soon... which is good news to you new hires hoping to get a quick jet upgrade. That being said, we're not too far from the 900 upgrades hitting the bottem of the list. At that point, seat locks are released on an as needed basis in order of seniority.

Sigep_nm was comparing MSP to DTW, not MEM to DTW. You will eventually have the choice between DTW and MEM, but maybe not right out of training. Between MEM and DTW, pick which ever base has the easiest commute. If that isn't a factor, IMHO Dtw has the best flying at XJ and MEM is historically the most junior base (which would give you better relative seniority). It all depends on what your priorities are.

Savvy?