alpar80

Think about it, would you really want an entity representing you, taking a cut out of your check, for representation that you really do not need? I mean are these folks really going to back you if you alone have a serious problem with the company? They are a corperation, there is a CEO, VP, and a whole group of suits who are profiting on your paycheck, claiming they will represent you if there is foul play in the company, but will they?

Overall, it seems to me, do you homework before you sign anything! Life isn't always better on the other side of the tracks. Remember you do have a chain of command, and seeing that you might have a bad day or bad week at work, think of all of those who don't even have jobs.
Not to bash unions, I am actually for unions, growing up in Boston I am commited to a union family. Unions can do a lot of good if your job security is constantly in jeopardy (not the case with Colgan) also if you are going to make a lifelong career out of this position. Case and point, and I dont have all the answers because I still have a lot of homework to do, this seems to be an attempt for a corperation to monopolize on the "safety interest issues and concerns" of regional airline pilots due to the instability that is currently taking place. Colgan is in the green, they are expanding, and your security is not in jeopardy. Get out there, work hard, and do your serve the one who is paying you. Eventhough it can be hard at times life wasn't made to be easy.

higney85

And is 2% of your paycheck a good insurance policy to pay on 100% of your earnings/QOL/working career? At any point mgmt can demand a 20% pay cut across the board and 10 day off months at Colgan and without a union you can either take it or leave... 2% at a regional level is nothin.

ErikCFII

Alex, I appreciate your points. However, aside from your light pro union comments, I felt it was a bit slanted. I'd like to try to even out the debate a bit.

You stated:

"...for representation that you really do not need?"

Thing is, you never know when you'll need the representation. You may not need it today, but who knows what situation you may find yourself in tomorrow.

"...I mean are these folks really going to back you if you alone have a serious problem with the company?"

Yes, as long as you have a legitimate case. They won't protect you from being stupid. You have the right to elect the people that will represent you. It's up to you to vote in those whom you feel have the professionalism, integrity, and moral character that you feel shall hold the various positions. I have seen seasoned Captains and probationary FOs backed by the union. I have seen both left high and dry by the union. The latter due to the fact that they placed themselves in situations that were impossible to defend against. Heck, sometimes the union will fight for a pilot's job even though s/he really shouldn't even have the job.

"Unions can do a lot of good if your job security is constantly in jeopardy (not the case with Colgan) ..."

Well, Pinnacle Corp is now in charge. I'd say Colgan pilot's jobs are in jeopardy.

"Colgan is in the green, they are expanding, and your security is not in jeopardy."

Colgan is in the "black". Yes, their security is in jeopardy.

I'm not a hardcore union guy. I do beleive a union is better than no union in the aviation industry. If it isn't ALPA, hopefully it is another union. Sure ALPA has screwed up along the way, but who is responsible for the MAJORITY of the current working conditions, pay and pension cuts, scheduling scams, understaffing, overworking of employees (all groups), inflated executive bonuses, bankruptcies, etc.? Corporate America and swayed politicians/judges. A union with enough cajones can change things.

Get some. (no that wasn't an insult directed at any particular person)

org1

The best reason to have a union is that no matter how good things are now, all it takes is a management change for it to all be gone. The only way to have any stability of work rules, pay, etc, is to have it in a contract. Even then, there are no guarantees, but it's better than nothing.

STR8NLVL

I get the feeling that you've not been at Colgan for too long?

A couple of strong reasons Colgan needs a union. 1) They regularly upgrade out of seniority order. How are you gonna like it when a guy junior to you upgrades months before you because his dad is friends with Chuck? It happens. 2) Pay on the Q400 is an insult and the Saab pay is less than industry average and second lowest among all saab operators. 3) Junior manning, enough said. 3) No per diem on day trips. 4) No duty rigs or trip rigs.

Most of the reasons are pay related. We all know going in to an airline what the hourly pay rate is, so no one is surprised when they go to work at Colgan as to the hourly pay. But its all the work rules that really make Colgan pay stink. Having no duty rigs and getting per diem only on overnights and not even on stand-up overnights make your checks SIGNIFICANTLY lower than they would be at most other airlines even if you figured the check using your current Colgan hourly rate.

Add to that the fact that ALPA represented pilots who lose their medicals for heart attacks get their medicals back in HALF the time of unrepresented pilots on average because of ALPA's team of medical professionals. Then there's their legal team to cover your back if you get into a violation situation. Then add the security you get by taking away Colgan's ability to threaten you if you refuse to fly a plane that you feel to be unsafe. Don't think it can happen? I saw first hand as a captain was threatened with their job because they refused to fly a plane with two derivative engines when our OPS manual specifically said a plane can only have one. Jeb said, "that was printed in error. We'll change it on the next revision. Fly the plane or we'll replace you with someone who will!" That could never happen at a union shop.

Need I go on?

Please send in your card, make Colgan a better place to work.

alpar80

All Im concerned about is the amount that they are going to take from us for dues and how much representation we are going to actually receive? How will it effect our pay scales, QOL, bidding, etc.. Where would one be able to read more on the representation we will be getting? You are right, I am new at the 121 world and am hearing a great deal from both sides, I need security with my job and for my family. I don't want to sign anything that could possibly jeopardize this in the future.

UWpilot

Alex,

2% is cheap insurance. Someone mentioned a busted PC as intimidation. Well, with a union that check airmen would be looking for a new job.

ALPA aeromedical is also a valuable resource. I was out with a condition and the docs back in Denver basically handled the feds for me. Nobody likes losing more of our dwindling paycheck but it is deductible on your tax return.

Just my 2 cents.

sflpilot

ALPA won't do much for your contract at the regional level like they would at a major. The real value of ALPA at the regionals is the legal, medical and other protection mechanisms of the union. There is no reason not to have a union. The dues will be worth it when you need their help to keep your job or get out of a situation. Look at what is happening at PNCL. I hope they push the company right over the edge. PNCL does not deserve to operate if they cannot have a respectable contract.

Fluboy340

saab. U dont work here anymore. U dont know anything. Do us a favor, worry about your company! And u are going to need too if things dont work out. And remember, carma is a **tch.

BoilerUP

That's not necessarily true; some regionals have better workrules than most of the legacy carriers these days.

Aeromedical has already saved my ass regarding a reporting issue on a previous medical and after watching my wife be diagnosed with diabetes there's no way I want to be in this career without Loss of License insurance. At my carrier, all probationary/Apprentice pilots have the same representation as Active members.

I could not agree more. My 1.95% is, IMO, money very well spent.