402DRVR

I don't do a lot of opining on this site but am curious how anyone can possibly call someone stuck up for believing they are worth a lot more than the pitiful 1st year wages a regional airline pays. having gone through two regionals I know pretty well the low pay game. Why is it arrogant to think that being responsible for 30 to 90 lives at a time is worth a little more than the low wages average regional guys make. I think it is pride, and professionalism to want to get paid what one is worth. Accepting it and being happy about it is completely unprofessional and shows very little respect for oneself. Sadly we all have to do what we have to do to make this career work. That does not mean we should sit back and say it is just okay because we love flying.

N6724G

You misunderstood my friend. I am not saying you are stuck up for expecting higher wages for what you do. I agree withthat. I am saying that in one voice you say you deserve higher wages, and in another voice you say the 500 hour pilot is a novice.

I guess the question I have is what is a 500-1000 hour worth? A lot of people on here say theyare green and the airlines are scrping the botom of the barrel by hiring them. Well, if this is the case. If they are the bottom of the barrell as some people say then what are they worth?

I agree with you. I wish regioanl FO's made more. I think they deserve it. Heck, I want to be one someday so of course I think they deserve it.

402DRVR

Fair enough. I left the industry four years ago to join the military. Ironically for stability and for higher pay. Plus the educ. bennies are pretty good. I took a pay raise going from a CRJ to cleaning the skipper's toilet. That's messed up. I kinda see what you are saying but remember that the average qualifications for pilots at the regionals has not always been 500 and 100. However, the pay scale has always been extremely low. Granted it has gotten worse post 9/11. So it really isn't a case of paying the pilot wha the is worth but what the company can get away with.

The facts of the matter are that a 500 hour pilot is less experienced and less prepared to do the job. This however is not the reason regional pay sucks. The reason is that Airline's are getting away with undercutting each other meaning the pilots have to work for less or lose out. Ironically, most of these pilot's are represented by the same National Union which claims to be trying to maintain the professionalism of the industry.

cruiseclimb

You're dead on this time Saab..

cruiseclimb

Now you're talking a completely different situation... Most of the pilot factory wonders don't have your leadership and decision making background... The stereotype doesn't apply to you. The extra time in the cockpit helps develope the stick skills, but most importantly, the decision process. That can be gained in other places.. you have done that. A buddy of mine was hired at CAL last month with really low pic time. They took him because of his leadership experience in the military. Different experience, same result.. Others who haven't been there may not understand or agree.

ghilis101

4G has a point here. I sat in the right seat of a DC-10 with under 300 hours and i never came close to killing anybody. The plane didnt fall out of the sky, and the captain wasnt upset that i was a low-timer.

soooooo, if the air force can put 300 hour guys in a 590,000 pound airplane, then i am all for a 500 hour guy getting into a 50,000 pound RJ.

if youre talking about fun, thats a whole different debate. this guy isnt factoring fun into it... plus i dont think its all that fun having to babysit a student pilot whos trying to kill you.

one more thing: Skywest's RJ ground school and Sims were faster paced and more challenging than Air Force training, and i imagine most regional carriers do the whole "fire-hose" training thing too. So Im convinced that you can take anybody and run them through that training and theyll be qualified to be an FO. They wont have the decision making and the real world experience that a captain must have, but hey its just a monkey swinging the gear and running the weight and balance.

Mesabah

At least 50K a year for any pilot with a commercial multi engine rating. Any job that has as much specialized on the job training as an airline pilot makes at least that. However, the airline will utilize you for all the time they possibly can because they are scraping the bottom of the barrel. Since this is the case, you have to ask yourself the question of what is at least half my life away from home worth?

Another thing you have to think about is that you have 500 hrs, and in one year you will be a captain with a 250hr guy next to you, or maybe even less. Do you think you will be ready for this? Your options will be to fly or quit, what is your back up plan if you have to quit? Flying with a low time guy makes this job extremely stressful on top of the regular stresses of this job. He may be qualified, but you don't know that. Most guys that have 1000 hrs or more are comfortable enough in an airplane that their behavior is more predictable.

So my final question is, you obviously don't want the pay or to enjoy working at this job, why do you even want it then? I mean why don't you get another 500 hrs of flying that is enjoyable first?

I think a lot of pilots somehow equate, airline job = exciting life. Actually it's quite the opposite, hiring low time pilots just makes a difficult job even worse. Heck, I would go back to flight instruction in a heartbeat if it payed more than $10,000 a year.

SlingAir

Any profession where someones life is in your hand, deserves at least a livable wage. When you take into consideration what we do, the training we have invested in, and the little to zero tolerance for error in our field, we deserve higher wages. Regardless of 500hr or 2500hr pilots. It's the same checkride, it's the same responsibility.

I understand the concept of first year pay, I however do not agree with it. Just because an airline has invested in you with a type rating doesn't give them the right to pay you poverty wages.

Salaries should have never gotten to the point where they are today. I believe this to be true for men and women of law enforcement and fire/rescue workers.

Just my 2cents, (SLING AIR steps off his soap box)