Public demand for more experienced pilots
03-15-2007, 06:58 AM
#141
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: B727
Posts: 194
I'm not sure how long "too long" is, but yes, I have been a captain for a long time. I've also worked for a number of airlines, mostly cargo, a few pax, mostly "bottom feeders". I must say, though, some of the bottomfeeders were good places to work, and some weren't. Even the lowest of them didn't exhibit the treatment of FOs you speak of. Maybe you weren't around quite long enough? Or possibly you were treated differently than the other FOs where you were working? I've always found a good FO or FE made my job easy. Most I flew with were good. Even the ones that were not were generally trainable and deserved respect.
At every airline I've worked for, the norm was for the FO to fly every other leg unless there was an overriding reason otherwise. This wasn't mandated; but most everyone did it. The FO was being trained to be a captain. The days of using the FO to move whatever lever the captain can't reach went out decades ago.
At every airline I've worked for, the norm was for the FO to fly every other leg unless there was an overriding reason otherwise. This wasn't mandated; but most everyone did it. The FO was being trained to be a captain. The days of using the FO to move whatever lever the captain can't reach went out decades ago.
Maybe you have been a captain for too long? The FO gets to push a few buttons but has no authority over anything. Whats worse every tiny event is micro evaluated by the captain, company and FAA. Not very glamorous or satisfying. Everything is scripted and proceduralised into robotic automation.
Even the walk around is mostly for show since maintenance does a more thorough and educated preflight check. New pilots are shown a handful of grainy pictures and are given only a slight background of what to look for.
The FO is a supurfulous entity that has very little purpose other than to serve as back up and to build on the job experience. They are not respected by anyone and if missing would only be noticed when it is time to read the check list.
After flying single pilot IFR in a piston twin over the cascades with command over everything involved with the flight it is a striking contrast to being a check list reader.
SkyHigh
Even the walk around is mostly for show since maintenance does a more thorough and educated preflight check. New pilots are shown a handful of grainy pictures and are given only a slight background of what to look for.
The FO is a supurfulous entity that has very little purpose other than to serve as back up and to build on the job experience. They are not respected by anyone and if missing would only be noticed when it is time to read the check list.
After flying single pilot IFR in a piston twin over the cascades with command over everything involved with the flight it is a striking contrast to being a check list reader.
SkyHigh
03-15-2007, 07:05 AM
#142
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: 170 babysitter
Posts: 417
All my jobs were for bottom feeders. Believe me I wish I could have gotten one of the better jobs. I am sure that at some of the nicer companies they treat the captain and FO with more respect however when many regionals only pay new FO's just over 18K my point is made for me.
I am not making any of this up. Perhaps it has been too long since you were a FO at a commuter, regional or start up? Things might be better at UPS but I can assure you that for most everyone else it is as I depicted.
SkyHigh
I am not making any of this up. Perhaps it has been too long since you were a FO at a commuter, regional or start up? Things might be better at UPS but I can assure you that for most everyone else it is as I depicted.
SkyHigh
You've been out of the game too long. You have no idea what youare talking about. I would only agree with the low pay argument but otherwise you sound like a teenager ranting on about something he has no clue about. Like one other poster said, pretty much none of that goes on at even the bottom feeder airlines. But keep on having your usual negative delusions.
03-15-2007, 12:35 PM
#143
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: SkyWest Capt.
Posts: 2,963
SkyHigh, you're what 41? Sorry your time in the industry was so horrible, or was it? I truly believe, based upon ALL YOUR POSTINGS, you're just a negative, delusional pessimist. I do hope that newbie’s who join the site do read your postings but walk away saying, "There're those in ever group!"
03-15-2007, 01:25 PM
#144
On Reserve
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: CL-65, CE550
Posts: 11
I have worked my share of regional, corporate and instructing jobs. And all I have to say is you have to look at your quality of life. If you are at a job with bad pay, schedule etc... and you dont like it then find a new job.
Majority of pilots that are going to regionals dont take the job because of the pay or the schedule. They take it because they enjoy the equipment they fly and because of the possibilities that can come from working for a regional.
Corporate pilots take those jobs usually because of the better starting pay (sometimes) and the fact that they get more time at home. At least thats what I enjoyed when I was flying corporate. I was able to build turbine time and get paid a more than I would have if I started at a regional. Oh yea and I got to be home most nights with my family. But the corporate world is totally different then regionals. There is a level of arrogance in the corporate world that most regionals dont have which is a plus.
Then being a CFI was just not for me. I didnt like having to sit on the edge of my seat for hours constantly correcting mistakes. Some people enjoy it but it wasnt for me.
I do believe there needs to be a standard for pilot pay. At some point the line will have to be drawn. Pilot pay cant keep going down while management pay goes up. Management forgets who the backbone of the company is.
Thats just my thoughts!
Majority of pilots that are going to regionals dont take the job because of the pay or the schedule. They take it because they enjoy the equipment they fly and because of the possibilities that can come from working for a regional.
Corporate pilots take those jobs usually because of the better starting pay (sometimes) and the fact that they get more time at home. At least thats what I enjoyed when I was flying corporate. I was able to build turbine time and get paid a more than I would have if I started at a regional. Oh yea and I got to be home most nights with my family. But the corporate world is totally different then regionals. There is a level of arrogance in the corporate world that most regionals dont have which is a plus.
Then being a CFI was just not for me. I didnt like having to sit on the edge of my seat for hours constantly correcting mistakes. Some people enjoy it but it wasnt for me.
I do believe there needs to be a standard for pilot pay. At some point the line will have to be drawn. Pilot pay cant keep going down while management pay goes up. Management forgets who the backbone of the company is.
Thats just my thoughts!
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