Letters of Investigation for VA benefits
06-25-2023, 12:23 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 351
Hardly.
If you're happy to collect benefits for a disability, then you do owe the FAA an explanation and documentation as to how you can have that disability and yet still qualify for an FAA medical.
It has nothing to do with gratitude or service. One is not entitled to a medical certificate; like a pilot certificate, it is a privilege. Not a right. It is based on meeting minimum standards. Either you meet them, or you do not. You don't get to substitute paid government service for medical qualification. You must be medically qualified.
If you accept money for disability, you may be medically qualified, or you may not. The fact that you're taking money for a disability does merit explanation of that disability on the FAA medical, and in fact, you have a legal obligation to provide it. End of story.
If you do have a disability that precludes holding a medical certificate (or obtaining a waiver to do so), then prior paid military service does not change the fact. Again, either you're qualified to hold the medical certificate, or you're not. If you're collecting paid benefits and claiming a disability, and you can meet FAA medical standards, then no problem. Disclose your condition, provide the documentation, and move forward. If you are not able to meet FAA medical standards, denial of a medical certificate has nothing whatsoever to do with gratitude. You're not above the regulation. You're not exempt from it. You're not any different than anyone else that applies for that medical certificate. You meet the standard, or you do not. If you do not, you can seek a waiver. If you cannot obtain a waiver and cannot meet the medical standards then you cannot hold a medical certificate.
Don't try to pretend it's anything different.
Having covered that; for those receiving a letter of investigation, it's important to understand that this is a legal document and should be treated accordingly. The purpose of a LOI is not to seek information in order to aid or assist an airman. Any response provided serves one purpose: to serve against the airman. One should not respond to an LOI, regardless of whether it involves a regulatory infraction in operations, or a medical certificate question, without consulting an attorney. That bears repeating: consult an attorney. Do that. Before you respond in any way. Additionally, seek the support of a medical service which provides counseling and support for airmen, in matters dealing with the FAA.This cannot be stressed enough, particularly given that every action taken becomes a part of your permanent, lifetime record.
Do NOT provide a response to an inquiry or letter of investigation until you have contacted an attorney.
If you are not familiar with administrative law and your "rights" with the FAA, you need to understand that you are NOT innocent until proven guilty, anything you say can and absolutely will be held against you, and much of the time, what serves as primary evidence is what the airman has provided to the FAA. This is true of responding to a request about action or a simple enquiry (the moment you respond "I wasn't flying that low," what you've really done is made a legal statement that you were the pilot of the flight...something that the FAA might have been unable to establish until you kindly provided that legal statement to use against you).
Respond under the guidance of legal counsel. Don't respond without it.
If you're happy to collect benefits for a disability, then you do owe the FAA an explanation and documentation as to how you can have that disability and yet still qualify for an FAA medical.
It has nothing to do with gratitude or service. One is not entitled to a medical certificate; like a pilot certificate, it is a privilege. Not a right. It is based on meeting minimum standards. Either you meet them, or you do not. You don't get to substitute paid government service for medical qualification. You must be medically qualified.
If you accept money for disability, you may be medically qualified, or you may not. The fact that you're taking money for a disability does merit explanation of that disability on the FAA medical, and in fact, you have a legal obligation to provide it. End of story.
If you do have a disability that precludes holding a medical certificate (or obtaining a waiver to do so), then prior paid military service does not change the fact. Again, either you're qualified to hold the medical certificate, or you're not. If you're collecting paid benefits and claiming a disability, and you can meet FAA medical standards, then no problem. Disclose your condition, provide the documentation, and move forward. If you are not able to meet FAA medical standards, denial of a medical certificate has nothing whatsoever to do with gratitude. You're not above the regulation. You're not exempt from it. You're not any different than anyone else that applies for that medical certificate. You meet the standard, or you do not. If you do not, you can seek a waiver. If you cannot obtain a waiver and cannot meet the medical standards then you cannot hold a medical certificate.
Don't try to pretend it's anything different.
Having covered that; for those receiving a letter of investigation, it's important to understand that this is a legal document and should be treated accordingly. The purpose of a LOI is not to seek information in order to aid or assist an airman. Any response provided serves one purpose: to serve against the airman. One should not respond to an LOI, regardless of whether it involves a regulatory infraction in operations, or a medical certificate question, without consulting an attorney. That bears repeating: consult an attorney. Do that. Before you respond in any way. Additionally, seek the support of a medical service which provides counseling and support for airmen, in matters dealing with the FAA.This cannot be stressed enough, particularly given that every action taken becomes a part of your permanent, lifetime record.
Do NOT provide a response to an inquiry or letter of investigation until you have contacted an attorney.
If you are not familiar with administrative law and your "rights" with the FAA, you need to understand that you are NOT innocent until proven guilty, anything you say can and absolutely will be held against you, and much of the time, what serves as primary evidence is what the airman has provided to the FAA. This is true of responding to a request about action or a simple enquiry (the moment you respond "I wasn't flying that low," what you've really done is made a legal statement that you were the pilot of the flight...something that the FAA might have been unable to establish until you kindly provided that legal statement to use against you).
Respond under the guidance of legal counsel. Don't respond without it.
06-25-2023, 12:47 PM
#12
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,254
In my opinion this is almost as much about a financial investigation as it is a medical one. The US government does not like being defrauded so if someone’s getting money for a disability it’s low hanging fruit to see if it is a legit claim. The FAA medical form makes this an incredibly easy task for them.
The question arises thereafter regarding a disability determined by the military, and its impact on FAA medical qualification. It's very possible for a legitimate disability claim in the military to have no impact on an FAA medical certificate. One can meet military disability standards and be determined worthy of collecting benefits, while at the same time one is perfectly capable of passing a flight physical.
The question here is one of disclosure. If an airman has hearing loss, for example, which is the single most common disability that the Department of Defense processes, then the question is whether the airman can meet the standards under 14 CFR Part 67, to hold a medical certificate. The military disability rating does not invalidate the medical or prevent its issue: these are two different organizations and two different standards. One can hold a military disability and yet qualify for a FAA medical certificate. FAA regulation requires disclosure of the disability and any documentation that goes with it, and the FAA medical standards are what determines the airman's ability to hold FAA medical certification.
On its face, anyone claiming a disbility, and at the same time claiming perfect health raises a question: reconciliation is warranted, either for financial/fraud reasons, or for (in this case) ensuring that one meets the FAA medical standard.
The key here is that this isn't a matter of searching the FAA airman database to find soldiers who might be committing fraud: that would be irrelevant, because the military has already made the disability determination. Rather, it's the opposite: the FAA requires disclosure of numerous conditions, including claims or assignments of disability. Upon that information having been declared, its a matter of determining how it impacts the FAA medical standard, and if it dos not, or if it does and a waiver can be issued, then the FAA medical process can proceed and the medical certificate issued, regardless of the military rating of disability.
The Civil Aerospace Medical Institute (CAMI--FAA's medical hq) is well aware of the difference between military disability ratings and FAA aeromedical standards, and quite aware that one can hold both a valid FAA medical, while holding a military disability rating. The regulation requires reconciliation and verification: disclose it and document it, including any additional testing that might be required to verify compliance with Part 67 standards. Same as anyone else applying for a medical.
When the matter becomes part of an investigation (we see you have a military disability that you didn't disclose...), then it becomes a matter that does need to be handled with counsel, because it's the start of the enforcement process. This process is the FAA looking at regulatory violation, and the violation isn't fraud, but failure to report, as required when applying for a medical certificate. In most cases, this can be handled easily, but one should tread lightly until one has consulted professional assistance.
Services such as AMAS can help, but any letter of investigation should be reviewed by legal counsel before responding. Put another way, you've been handed a weapon which is not safe: don't just pull the trigger. There's a safe way to handle it, and there's a careless way to handle it. Get help.
06-25-2023, 01:12 PM
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 351
Perhaps, except for two things: this is the exact opposite of what you're describing, and the government isn't looking for military disability fraud. When the military determines disability, it's not a case of a soldier claiming a disability and that simply being granted: the military looks at each case and assigns a percentage of disability. While it's beyond question that many military disabilities are quite valid, it's also very well known that many are not; I know a number personally who have received disability ratings based on a military assessment, who are anything but disabled. This isn't a case of fraud: the military has made the determination.
The question arises thereafter regarding a disability determined by the military, and its impact on FAA medical qualification. It's very possible for a legitimate disability claim in the military to have no impact on an FAA medical certificate. One can meet military disability standards and be determined worthy of collecting benefits, while at the same time one is perfectly capable of passing a flight physical.
The question here is one of disclosure. If an airman has hearing loss, for example, which is the single most common disability that the Department of Defense processes, then the question is whether the airman can meet the standards under 14 CFR Part 67, to hold a medical certificate. The military disability rating does not invalidate the medical or prevent its issue: these are two different organizations and two different standards. One can hold a military disability and yet qualify for a FAA medical certificate. FAA regulation requires disclosure of the disability and any documentation that goes with it, and the FAA medical standards are what determines the airman's ability to hold FAA medical certification.
On its face, anyone claiming a disbility, and at the same time claiming perfect health raises a question: reconciliation is warranted, either for financial/fraud reasons, or for (in this case) ensuring that one meets the FAA medical standard.
The key here is that this isn't a matter of searching the FAA airman database to find soldiers who might be committing fraud: that would be irrelevant, because the military has already made the disability determination. Rather, it's the opposite: the FAA requires disclosure of numerous conditions, including claims or assignments of disability. Upon that information having been declared, its a matter of determining how it impacts the FAA medical standard, and if it dos not, or if it does and a waiver can be issued, then the FAA medical process can proceed and the medical certificate issued, regardless of the military rating of disability.
The Civil Aerospace Medical Institute (CAMI--FAA's medical hq) is well aware of the difference between military disability ratings and FAA aeromedical standards, and quite aware that one can hold both a valid FAA medical, while holding a military disability rating. The regulation requires reconciliation and verification: disclose it and document it, including any additional testing that might be required to verify compliance with Part 67 standards. Same as anyone else applying for a medical.
When the matter becomes part of an investigation (we see you have a military disability that you didn't disclose...), then it becomes a matter that does need to be handled with counsel, because it's the start of the enforcement process. This process is the FAA looking at regulatory violation, and the violation isn't fraud, but failure to report, as required when applying for a medical certificate. In most cases, this can be handled easily, but one should tread lightly until one has consulted professional assistance.
Services such as AMAS can help, but any letter of investigation should be reviewed by legal counsel before responding. Put another way, you've been handed a weapon which is not safe: don't just pull the trigger. There's a safe way to handle it, and there's a careless way to handle it. Get help.
The question arises thereafter regarding a disability determined by the military, and its impact on FAA medical qualification. It's very possible for a legitimate disability claim in the military to have no impact on an FAA medical certificate. One can meet military disability standards and be determined worthy of collecting benefits, while at the same time one is perfectly capable of passing a flight physical.
The question here is one of disclosure. If an airman has hearing loss, for example, which is the single most common disability that the Department of Defense processes, then the question is whether the airman can meet the standards under 14 CFR Part 67, to hold a medical certificate. The military disability rating does not invalidate the medical or prevent its issue: these are two different organizations and two different standards. One can hold a military disability and yet qualify for a FAA medical certificate. FAA regulation requires disclosure of the disability and any documentation that goes with it, and the FAA medical standards are what determines the airman's ability to hold FAA medical certification.
On its face, anyone claiming a disbility, and at the same time claiming perfect health raises a question: reconciliation is warranted, either for financial/fraud reasons, or for (in this case) ensuring that one meets the FAA medical standard.
The key here is that this isn't a matter of searching the FAA airman database to find soldiers who might be committing fraud: that would be irrelevant, because the military has already made the disability determination. Rather, it's the opposite: the FAA requires disclosure of numerous conditions, including claims or assignments of disability. Upon that information having been declared, its a matter of determining how it impacts the FAA medical standard, and if it dos not, or if it does and a waiver can be issued, then the FAA medical process can proceed and the medical certificate issued, regardless of the military rating of disability.
The Civil Aerospace Medical Institute (CAMI--FAA's medical hq) is well aware of the difference between military disability ratings and FAA aeromedical standards, and quite aware that one can hold both a valid FAA medical, while holding a military disability rating. The regulation requires reconciliation and verification: disclose it and document it, including any additional testing that might be required to verify compliance with Part 67 standards. Same as anyone else applying for a medical.
When the matter becomes part of an investigation (we see you have a military disability that you didn't disclose...), then it becomes a matter that does need to be handled with counsel, because it's the start of the enforcement process. This process is the FAA looking at regulatory violation, and the violation isn't fraud, but failure to report, as required when applying for a medical certificate. In most cases, this can be handled easily, but one should tread lightly until one has consulted professional assistance.
Services such as AMAS can help, but any letter of investigation should be reviewed by legal counsel before responding. Put another way, you've been handed a weapon which is not safe: don't just pull the trigger. There's a safe way to handle it, and there's a careless way to handle it. Get help.
08-31-2023, 02:21 PM
#14
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 96
So based on the article from WAPO...the FAA is conducting writ large secret investigations into pilot who receive VA benefits...*only* pilots who receive VA benefits. Secret investigations conducted by investigators who were previously employed, and presumably have their retirement pensions controlled by, the former agency, department and section they retired from.
What a great investigative strategy...would work well in Moscow or Berlin 1940. Anyone who thinks the med guys at the FAA aren't simply out to get people need to read no further than "secret." That is not the way a democratic government entity should do business outside of a clear criminal nexus. Not listing that you have hemorrhoids or ED on an FAA medical, does not constitute a criminal nexus yet that act could get you caught up in the same net.
Tax $$$ at work people. DoD breaks you, VA buys you, then FAA takes you back for a refund.
What a great investigative strategy...would work well in Moscow or Berlin 1940. Anyone who thinks the med guys at the FAA aren't simply out to get people need to read no further than "secret." That is not the way a democratic government entity should do business outside of a clear criminal nexus. Not listing that you have hemorrhoids or ED on an FAA medical, does not constitute a criminal nexus yet that act could get you caught up in the same net.
Tax $$$ at work people. DoD breaks you, VA buys you, then FAA takes you back for a refund.
08-31-2023, 04:37 PM
#15
Disinterested Third Party
Joined APC: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,254
So based on the article from WAPO...the FAA is conducting writ large secret investigations into pilot who receive VA benefits...*only* pilots who receive VA benefits. Secret investigations conducted by investigators who were previously employed, and presumably have their retirement pensions controlled by, the former agency, department and section they retired from.
I was going to break down your post and respond line by line, but your comments are so god damn idiotic, conspiracy-minded, and incredibly stupid, that it would be a waste of time. Seriously.
Quite literally, not one damn thing that you just posted is true. Are you really that dense, and that far off the deep end, or are you simply trying to stir the pot with this nonsense?
08-31-2023, 11:33 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2022
Posts: 1,144
09-01-2023, 06:24 AM
#17
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 96
So, no. So, you have no idea what you're talking about. So, you have a real problem with reading comprehension. So, you're making a lot of **** up. The only question is why?
I was going to break down your post and respond line by line, but your comments are so god damn idiotic, conspiracy-minded, and incredibly stupid, that it would be a waste of time. Seriously.
Quite literally, not one damn thing that you just posted is true. Are you really that dense, and that far off the deep end, or are you simply trying to stir the pot with this nonsense?
I was going to break down your post and respond line by line, but your comments are so god damn idiotic, conspiracy-minded, and incredibly stupid, that it would be a waste of time. Seriously.
Quite literally, not one damn thing that you just posted is true. Are you really that dense, and that far off the deep end, or are you simply trying to stir the pot with this nonsense?
Im not sure what there is for you to refute, except some opinion I’ve applied that you probably disagree with, but the facts are the facts. Here is the article JohnnyB…read it for yourself:https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...s-va-benefits/
09-01-2023, 07:52 AM
#18
Perennial Reserve
Joined APC: Jan 2018
Posts: 12,069
Im not sure what there is for you to refute, except some opinion I’ve applied that you probably disagree with, but the facts are the facts. Here is the article JohnnyB…read it for yourself:https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...s-va-benefits/
But it ain’t about money. The VA will grab every dollar Congress will give them and spend every cent of it before midnight on the day the fiscal year ends, fearing that any left over surplus will mean they get less in the next appropriation cycle.
09-01-2023, 09:06 AM
#19
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,992
So based on the article from WAPO...the FAA is conducting writ large secret investigations into pilot who receive VA benefits...*only* pilots who receive VA benefits. Secret investigations conducted by investigators who were previously employed, and presumably have their retirement pensions controlled by, the former agency, department and section they retired from.
What a great investigative strategy...would work well in Moscow or Berlin 1940. Anyone who thinks the med guys at the FAA aren't simply out to get people need to read no further than "secret." That is not the way a democratic government entity should do business outside of a clear criminal nexus. Not listing that you have hemorrhoids or ED on an FAA medical, does not constitute a criminal nexus yet that act could get you caught up in the same net.
Tax $$$ at work people. DoD breaks you, VA buys you, then FAA takes you back for a refund.
Tax $$$ at work people. DoD breaks you, VA buys you, then FAA takes you back for a refund.
However... most of the pilots in question were officers and should know better. Fundamentally if you're claiming big $ and lying to the FAA, it's criminal. Even says so where you sign the form.
Especially since there have already been two rounds of disability witch hunt, and the most recent was for vets. While it was apparently smaller in scope, that should have been a big warning flare for all to see. My sympathy is limited. I can see how folks went down the slippery slope, it is both steep and slippery enough, but still.
I tend to suspect that they'll save the full DOJ treatment for those with blatant grounding conditions. Those flying with unreported hemorrhoids might get a warning. Or maybe even suspension. For the serious cases, I'm sure emergency revocation of all certs will be coming soon via certified mail..
09-01-2023, 09:12 AM
#20
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 39,992
Perhaps, except for two things: this is the exact opposite of what you're describing, and the government isn't looking for military disability fraud. When the military determines disability, it's not a case of a soldier claiming a disability and that simply being granted: the military looks at each case and assigns a percentage of disability. While it's beyond question that many military disabilities are quite valid, it's also very well known that many are not; I know a number personally who have received disability ratings based on a military assessment, who are anything but disabled. This isn't a case of fraud: the military has made the determination.
Since the VA (federal gov) examined people and granted ratings, it's very easy to hold up those medical conditions and disability payments as findings of fact... from there, the infraction is failure to disclose those facts to the FAA when required to do so.
If you try to discount VA ratings, then you're calling into question the ability of the entire VA system to adjudicate claims... defense would turn that against you in a flash, big Can 'O Worms.
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