MinRest

Yea I am not sure what is was back then but I don't think it was quite as high as 1 per day. Too long ago to remember but attrition with pilots of 2 years seniority or less was pretty high too. I think now you have a lot more senior NJA pilots looking to leave.

UTR69

Well, the deadline has come and gone…. Any bets on something before the end of the year.

I’m thinking they will pull a rabbit out of the hat to avoid showing profit sharing numbers…..thoughts?

Av8rg8r

Considering they don't have to cut a check for EFPP until Jan 2025, I'd bet they're hoping to steamroll the pilots and beat down their morale as much as possible. I've seen/heard what they did to the FA and dispatcher's unions, and something tells me they're aiming to do the same to the pilot's group. As much as I'd like to make this job the one I retire from, if the company doesn't pull its head from it's fourth point of contact, I will be leaving for the Majors.

JMO127

So what about the email from ML or the NC about how many great strides were made since the LBFO yet they won't disclose the details..... seems fishy. I still don't think many understand how sell-offs work. Most of the union wants the company to fall on its face during peak season. If it does, the EFPP will be all but worthless. By sticking it to the company, you're really sticking it to yourselves and the EFPP you're holding on to so tightly. Serious question, do you think the company loses money on sell-offs? The answer is no. They make, not lose or at worst, break even. That cut scabbed over a long time ago. More scabs than cuts it seems.

Av8rg8r

I'm still trying to figure out if you're a company stooge without access to union communications or if you're really that ignorant of a line pilot with your head stuck that far in the sand? I'm just a regular line pilot and I have a very good idea of what's going on with negotiations, so you can take your "seems fishy" bull**** and shove it back up your ass. Also, I don't remember bringing up sell-offs at all during my previous comment that you felt compelled to reply to, but since you're bringing it up, I'll go ahead and address it.

1. Mr. and Mrs. Moneybanks pay for shares on XYZ aircraft at Netjets.
2. Netjets is unable to provide lift to Mr. and Mrs. Moneybanks due to (Maintenance availability, Pilot availability, overbooking, take your pick), and purchases supplemental lift from another 135 operator.
3. Netjets cost comparison: Providing lift on a QS tail provides a profit margin of say, 10% (note, not real numbers). Supplemental lift eats that profit margin and potentially eats into the fees charged for monthly maintenance of the account. Netjets effectively admitted to as much when they pushed for the 2.5x LOA.
4. Benefits to Netjets for sell-offs: fewer hours on airframes and possibly allowing maintenance availability to climb. Downsides: Mr. and Mrs. Moneybanks don't receive the same level of service and get upset with Netjets, and money that would be going into Netjets bank accounts and subsequently BH accounts instead goes to another 135 operator.

Yes, I know the above is highly simplified, but I fully understand both the benefits and drawbacks to sell-offs, including the fact that a downturn in the 2024 books for profits results in a reduced EFPP. Here's your/our problem however. The EFPP is a 3 year deal, that's it. After that, there's no guarantee we get it back in another contract or an amendment to this contract. Hell, the Company already wants to withdraw the EFPP. Increased pay needs to be in base wages, and needs to be enough to stop us from being a stepping-stone to the airlines. Almost all of our new hires are planning on getting their turbine time and leaving for the majors. That wouldn't be a big deal if our training pipeline were set up to handle that amount of turnover, but it's not, and is evidenced by the current wait for IOE across almost all fleets. Almost no one is bidding for TR/CA/NRFO positions because at this point, the pay is an insult for the amount of work required, and so the wait continues to go longer and longer for IOE and line checks. Wait, what about FDPP you say? It's great if you're in a good fleet without maintenance issues.

Point being, I'm not buying what you're selling, and neither is the majority of the pilot group. Go peddle your fear-mongering and doubt at Bridgeway instead, and actually be useful for once. My Union Speaks For Me.

hawkerpilot05

The backlog for IOE is so bad the company just cancelled 100 Initials in non-large cabin aircraft. They have been pushback to next spring. What is the poi t of typing pilots when they sit for 4-6 months waiting on IOE. Add to the fact most non- turbine new hire IOE pilots have to go into the additional block of IOE, it takes longer for them to finish which ties up the TR's.

Swedepilut

I’m more interested in Pedros cryptic email from the other day.

There is a story behind that one that’s for sure.

500RVR

United pilot here. Are you guys under the Railway Labor Act (RLA)? If not when can you strike?

Best of luck!

AntiPeter

They are under the RLA.

Their contract is not up for Section 6 negotiation for years.

The union and pilot group have supported a IBB process for the last several years, giving the company almost all leverage. The pilots have been voluntarily castrated, and their current CBA discourages solidarity/unified work action because of add-pay provisions. The metal keeps moving...

And then there is their "union"...

Long story, AJ and Uncle Warren are the only happy campers. Along with a group of pilots that successfully know how to suck up.

It's a damn shame...but largely self inflicted -- and those that don't like it are labeled as anti-union outcasts. The only potential salvation is attrition and inability to hire, but those market forces have not yet translated into benefits for the meager and beaten down line pilot of NJA/NJASAP.

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MinRest

This is perfectly stated.