xjtguy

Are you SURE thats the case? As well as will be the case if/when they ever hire again?

I knew more than a few civilians that were hired in that time frame, NONE of them had PIC in a heavy with overwater/ClassII nav experience.

They did have SIC time in those operations, ALL of their PIC time was at the regionals. They went from RJ CA to the various ACMI outfits, then to UPS. Many of them I know came from GAC. One pilot, that I haven't seen post on here in a while didn't even have the "heavy-jet" time. Just narrow body/non "heavy-jet", yet STILL has ClassII nav experience in it.

And if I'm not mistaken, the heavy/ClassII nav requirement only lasted for a few rounds of hiring classes before it got dropped again.

Because, AGAIN, I new guys that went after that, and AGAIN, ALL their time was in the lowly little RJ's with NO heavy/overwater/ClassII nav experience.

PotatoChip

I know several guys go straight from the regional to FedEx. My plan was to do the whole 747 heavy time thing.... then the furlough came and now I am barely paying rent. Great plan.

cactipilot

I say go to a "good" regional (well, whatever that means) since the DoD budget is going to be in for a bumpy ride coming up for the near future and might as well get in on the seniority band wagon asap. I've been told the hard requirements for the Majors will be reduced, not making it easy or uncompetitive, but allowing the hiring dept to pick good people without just gunning for high timers, PIC, etc... and MIL/121 experience will be a good pick. This is from 2 hiring committee guys at a major.

highsky

I have great empathy for both military and civilian guys who are reading these posts. I was both. I know how hard it is to be a civilian guy trying to make it in this industry. You guys have huge balls. I don't know if I would have had the stomach to go for it, graduating from ERAU in '90, had I not gotten into the USAF Reserve in '94.

And as far as the American Warfighter goes: Right behind your Lord and your mother, I am your third biggest fan. I fully recognize that Liberty's Light burns bright today only becuase of the sacrifices you guys continue to make every day. God Bless you all. I love all of you, and would do ANYTHING for you.

I want all of you to succeed in life, civilian and military alike. I know there are some people reading these posts who may be interested in a career with UPS. I don't want to be a buzzkill and dash anyone's hopes and dreams. I just want to state the facts, so that you all can make some realistic decisions on which direction to take with your life. I know full well the anxiety of this career. I didn't end up at UPS until I was 38.

I went back and looked up the resumes of my classmates on the UPS website. I made a couple of mistakes to my earlier post: For civilian guys, in addition to 747 and MD-11 Cargo Captains, we had one L-1011 Captain. We also one straight 767 Captain with a ton of PIC international time with Avianca. He was born in Colombia, he was the senior at 43, and he was a super nice guy and sharp pilot.

For the Fighter guys who want a career with UPS, I apologize. I don't want to scare you into thinking you don't have a chance. My class had ONE guy with a fighter background. He was an F/A-18 Naval Reserve Squadron Commander. He was a genius, a gentleman, and a stellar pilot. He had educational degrees, and both civilian and military accomplishments up the ying-yang. He was also a furloughed UAL 767 FO with Class II Nav experience.

Those are the facts, as they pertain to my class of about 18. At the time, DEC 06, UPS had a policy of requiring 1000 PIC Heavy-jet, Transoceanic. This happened because at the time, all new-hires were going to PANC to fly the MD-11, which is legendary for its landing challenges. After several expensive landing incidents where the flying pilot had an RJ or Fighter background, they decided they would only hire pilots with Heavy-jet backgrounds.

Since they had over 10,000 applicants on file, they had the luxury of being VERY selective with whom they hired. I had a solid resume, and three internal recs from military friends. I didn't hear dick for a year and a half.

Here's the thing that finally did it for me: I went to an Air Inc seminar (at the insistence of my close UPS friend, who happens to be black.) He told me to get my ass ASAP to the next OBAP or Air Inc Seminar I could find. He was right. I went to the Air Inc Seminar at KIAD, NOV '06. I skipped the first day, and just showed up for the second day Meet n Greet at the booths. I stood in line with others, but when I got up to the front, the eyebrows raised, and the felt pens began enthusiastically circling items on my resume. They said, "Wow, nice. You should be hearing something in a week." Five days later, I got the call from UPS HR.

What will the minimums be after they have recalled all of our furloughed brothers and start to hire again? Who knows? But I would think that UPS will be a very attractive destination for pilots for many years to come, with hiring standards that reflect such exclusivity.

My experiences only reflect my particular slice in time. Your experiences may vary. Take it for what it's worth.

For you military "bums" who are wondering what you're going to do with your lives for the next couple of years, I firmly believe that you're going to have PLENTY of work, come this time next year. There will be Man-days-a-Plenty after WWIII lights off here soon. Israel is going to be front and center. Whether our CINC backs up our ally remains to be seen, but I'm confident/hope we're going to have a HUGE roll in all of this.

God Bless you all, and God Bless America.

If there is anything I can do to help, I'm here 365/24/7.

Dan

xjtguy

Not sure how the whole mil/cvi thing got into this, anyways.......

Like I said, I'm not sure that was EXACTLY the case. Guys from BOTH the regionals I worked at were hired at UPS at that time. And I SPECIFICALLY remember doing the app/resume upload at that time. 1000TPIC was there, as well as the ClassII nav experience. Don't remember the REQUIREMENT for the heavy PIC. The guys I know that got hired NEVER had heavy PIC, they were MD11 FO's at World and GAC.

What was comical to read (on this message board) wasn't mil vs' civ peeing contest, but the inter-platform rivalry-bickering that ensued between fighter and tanker/transport at that time.

highsky

The title of this thread is "Bum or Regional." I don't understand why a civilian would be reading this. Nonetheless, I recognized that there were civilians like you reading it, so I tried to share some info I thought may be useful to you as well.

I don't doubt that you had RJ friends get hired at UPS earlier in '06. I remember talking with many of those guys myself. But I never heard of an RJ or fighter guy get hired after I did (DEC 06).

highsky

My best advice about UPS is to relax. The entire pilot HR department was dissolved in 07. Those people are gone. When they do start hiring again, it will be new people, with new philosophies. I doubt there will be a hard requirement for 1000 Heavy PIC.

xjtguy

Really? Really dude?

But sure, let's make it so that civilans can't read the mil thread and contribute a perspective, ESPECIALLY if they have regional experience. Let's also make it so mil CAN'T read ANY civ threads.

Let's escalate the classic mil vs. civ threads to an epic level!!!!!!!!!

Where's the furlough line?

Because 2 of my friends are currently furloughed, NEITHER had 1000 heavy jet PIC. All the PIC was RJ.

Another friend of mine was recalled, ZERO heavy/ClassII nav time what so ever.

highsky

Wow. You are one classy dude.

Adios.

xjtguy

Sorry, what did you expect with your "civilians shouldn't be reading this" attitude?

Talk about classy. Were you hired as a UPS management pilot?