Logging AF time
06-04-2009, 01:05 PM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
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Joined APC: Mar 2006
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Logging AF time
I've got a print out of all my AF flights from the ARMS shop. I want to get a logbook for my military time. In the AF we log from gear-up to gear-down. Civilians log engine start to engin shutdown. Should I add 0.3 to each sortie or take my total time and multiply it by 0.3? This gets a little sticky when you factor in the time allotted for working red balls while up on engines. I'm not looking to "pencil-whip" my time and make it look much higher than it is; I'm looking for the acceptable answer the Feds and future employers would find reasonable. Thanks in asvance.
06-04-2009, 01:16 PM
#2
Libertarian Resistance
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: 757 FO
Posts: 1,057
There have been a lot of threads devoted to the military conversion issues in logbooks. Many different ways to skin that cat.
As to your specific question, I personally wouldn't add any time, but I would keep count of the sorties. If your interviewer wants to add time he can use that number and multiply by .3 (or whatever). Others may disagree with my method.
Search the thread history, you'll find a lot of good info.
WW
As to your specific question, I personally wouldn't add any time, but I would keep count of the sorties. If your interviewer wants to add time he can use that number and multiply by .3 (or whatever). Others may disagree with my method.
Search the thread history, you'll find a lot of good info.
WW
06-04-2009, 02:18 PM
#3
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Ditto on what WW said.
However, I'll just try to head off a waste of time before you purchase a logbook. Don't bother trying to put your military time into a logbook after the fact. Your AF flight records are more than adequate to document your military flight time. Any additions per sortie, tweaking of PIC based on the definition of PIC by the company you apply to, breakout of instructor/evaluator hours, etc. can be done on a cover sheet explaining your math.
Any civilian time you've already logged or will log (like getting your ATP) obviously needs to be in a logbook. It's okay if that's separate from your mil time. Good luck.
However, I'll just try to head off a waste of time before you purchase a logbook. Don't bother trying to put your military time into a logbook after the fact. Your AF flight records are more than adequate to document your military flight time. Any additions per sortie, tweaking of PIC based on the definition of PIC by the company you apply to, breakout of instructor/evaluator hours, etc. can be done on a cover sheet explaining your math.
Any civilian time you've already logged or will log (like getting your ATP) obviously needs to be in a logbook. It's okay if that's separate from your mil time. Good luck.
06-04-2009, 07:18 PM
#6
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Joined APC: Dec 2007
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Do you really know what you are supposed to log in the USAF? It is takeoff to landing plus taxi time up to 5 minutes.
USAF and civilian logbooks are different - there is nothing to say that you can't keep a civilian logbook. And there is nothing to say that you can't log exactly what you would log if you were in a G-III or B-727. It is just easier for most to take the USAF numbers and use them.
USAF and civilian logbooks are different - there is nothing to say that you can't keep a civilian logbook. And there is nothing to say that you can't log exactly what you would log if you were in a G-III or B-727. It is just easier for most to take the USAF numbers and use them.
06-04-2009, 08:48 PM
#7
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06-04-2009, 09:48 PM
#8
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In the Army we are governed by AR 95-1 "Flying time starts when an airplane begins to move forward on the takeoff roll or when a helicopter lifts off the ground. Flying time ends when the aircraft has landed and the engines are stopped or the flying crew changes."
It is my belief and that of several colleagues that you log in your logbook what you fly in accordance with regulations under which you are flying. That is, if you are flying under FAA rules, you log accordingly. If you are flying under AF, Army, etc., you log according to their specific rules. Airlines may or may not add to that for their hiring purposes, but that is on the individual airline to determine.. If your hour printout is 1000 hours from the military but your logbook says 1300, the airline may think you are trying to fudge it.
That said, your logbook is yours and you can put in it whatever you want.
It is my belief and that of several colleagues that you log in your logbook what you fly in accordance with regulations under which you are flying. That is, if you are flying under FAA rules, you log accordingly. If you are flying under AF, Army, etc., you log according to their specific rules. Airlines may or may not add to that for their hiring purposes, but that is on the individual airline to determine.. If your hour printout is 1000 hours from the military but your logbook says 1300, the airline may think you are trying to fudge it.
That said, your logbook is yours and you can put in it whatever you want.
06-04-2009, 11:33 PM
#9
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I can't imagine how you'd multiply by 1.3 to make up for the extra taxi time. Unless you're doing some brutally long taxi's, or some very short sorties, I think the acceptable technique might be to add .3 to each sortie.
Think about it, I assume a 4 hour sortie in a Bone isn't unreasonable(?) If you were to multiply you'd be adding an additional 1.2 hours of taxi time. Which seems excessive.
Think about it, I assume a 4 hour sortie in a Bone isn't unreasonable(?) If you were to multiply you'd be adding an additional 1.2 hours of taxi time. Which seems excessive.
06-05-2009, 09:12 AM
#10
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I built a pretty simple spreadsheet on excel that added .3 for every sortie. The spreadsheet showed both times and explained the adjustment. That way they can use whatever number they want.
I used the spreadsheet as a cover letter for my times. The next sheet was a letter from flight records verifying my flight records were correct and then I had the standard flight time and sortie summary computer printout that the SARMS have you sign every year at your flight records review. Never kept a logbook in my life.
The airline spent a total of 2-3 minutes reviewing it and listening to my explanations and that was that.
I used the spreadsheet as a cover letter for my times. The next sheet was a letter from flight records verifying my flight records were correct and then I had the standard flight time and sortie summary computer printout that the SARMS have you sign every year at your flight records review. Never kept a logbook in my life.
The airline spent a total of 2-3 minutes reviewing it and listening to my explanations and that was that.
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