Monocoupe

That's not what I'm getting at. What can the pilot group do to push the company holders outside of unionized organization? What specifications of the RR Act cover certain actions and not others. What outside sources could be of value that can weigh in and have sentimental value to opposition. Why rely on a source that has failed over and over again. Search for an intellectual(s) with power who(m) can benifit and change will come

No Land 3

Just an observation... At the regional and acmi levels, every new pilot contract that came out, was due to people leaving, people not coming to interview, not show up at class, flying being turned away due to staffing, and most importantly, the company realizing they needed to pay more to attract and retain talent, and work with the union to make it happen.
It was never because the pilot group complained. All pilots complain, no matter how much they make, or what equipment they fly, or how much time they have at home.
The only way you have the ball in your court, is to use your feet.

Monocoupe

I fully understand and respect your observation but that makes zero case as towards what I'm trying to get across. To say that the only power you have is with your feet is silly and quite frankly ignorant. What, waddle away with your tail beneath your legs? With a will comes a way and this is no different; think outside the box.

nordo

Have you even looked at a summary of the RLA? The law basically gives control of everything to the company and union contracts are what carve out pilot (and FA) work rules. There are very few to no "outside the box" solutions under the RLA. When it was written in the 1930s Congress pretty much sewed up any possible ad-hoc solutions to none.

For those who get upset about what the MAG Officers and others do, they're not the negotiators, rather they take care of representation for every pilot at discipline hearings, training review boards, grievance meetings, ASAP/ERC meetings and other things that keep the day-to-day functions going for the pilots group.

BeatNavy

Ha ok. They all voted yes for the POS 2015 TA and spent a ton of money trying to sell that garbage to the pilot group. They also guide the NC and ensure the pilots' desires are being represented and negotiated, and when negotiations don't progress, they are supposed to look for additional resources to facilitate/force the process. And negotiations have taken far too long with too little progress to be acceptable.

Sumtinwong

Yeah, the sooner they realize that JO isn't going to play ball on the level that other airlines are, the sooner we can start the mediation process.

It's an absolute joke how poorly this is being handled. There is NO excuse for it. Its a chess game and we are getting our butts handed to us. The union will tell you that they are currently negotiating, but truth is, they aren't. Things have been stalled for some time. They are letting the company drive the agenda and that has to stop. File for mediation, start the process, and lets stop wasting time.

A contract without industry average pay and clear improvements WILL NOT PASS. To introduce one that doesn't put us squarely in the mix with other airlines is simply a complete waste of time.

Bucknut

When everyone at Mesa realizes that ALPA or JO does not put your needs at the forefront, the better off you will be. I went through the Contract negotiations in 2003 while at Mesa. I had a very poignant discussion with one of our MEC council members. I stated that given the culture of the company and I am referring to management along with some of the senior pilots, I understood that we were never going to get a significant pay raise. I was number 53 out of 153 captains in my base and somewhere just south of 300 out of 1500 on the seniority list. My request was simply a better schedule than averaging 10 days off a month. I wanted things to go away like deadheading on the first day of a trip to overnight and that was all that scheduled for the day. These are things that do not cost the company money and is more efficient. My MEC rep in his spineless response said he did not think that the Union could accomplish that. I knew right then and there that from the experience of being there for six years and the mentality that was pervasive that things were never going to change and for that matter still have not. My advice is to get out of there, life is too short to live with that crap and you will be much happier!!!! I hope this gives a little history and perspective to those thinking about going there or thinking about leaving. I did not bring up the Fredom Air issue, but that is just another case study of what the management mindset is.

No Land 3

Waddle away with your tail between your legs? I was jumping, skipping, singing away. Well, actually I was running away. My last flight at Mesa, the cockpit was full of Mosquito's from Mexico.
I hear what you are saying, but I think you need to look outside your box, unless of course you plan on staying at Mesa until you retire. You need to think about how much money you are losing by staying. Granted, not every upward move will be a pay increase first year.

Monocoupe

Maybe I'll just become a manager at Jimmy Johns...that sounds nice right now

Out Of Trim

I'm not sure that it would lead to something better. But, I doubt they would allow a close personal friend of our CEO to serve as a union official. I would not expect any union to allow such a blatant conflict of interest. Since nothing else seems to be working, perhaps solving that problem (in addition to mediation) is our best first course of action?