Originally Posted by Duct Mon

You have got be one of the most clueless people on here. I as well as many others grow tired of your postings. I don't normally bash someone or someone's opinion but you are as ignorant as they come. Have you noticed that there aren't many that are agreeing with your posts?
You came here under the same conditions as any new hire today. In fact the new hires ARE getting more money than you did. Your comparisons about other regionals having similar pay back then is true to a certain degree. But, what you fail to mention is there were many more regionals with more pay and better contracts. You could have gone there. Maybe you were blinded by the "Shiny Jet Syndrome" or quick upgrade like any others that are on property. As far as what the new hires today are attracted to are the same as when you were hired. 1st year pay isn't even a consideration to most of these. Quick upgrade, new airplanes, growing company, domiciles, easy interview, good training Dept, less time on RSV, are still the top considerations.
I would like to go into detail about your argument regarding your claims of new hire classes empty equal higher pay in a new contract. I am going to simplify this for you because I have seen how difficult it is for you to understand labor and economics.
First off is what you fail to recognize are the reasons why new pilots are coming here. It isn't about 1st year pay.
Second, the Fee for Departure and contracts to which Mesa gets paid.
If you think that empty classrooms equals a new contract you are as simple as they come. Most recently you can see it didn't work for Republic. They couldn't fill classes, new contract, classes started to fill, rumor of bk, empty classes, loss of flying, pilots quitting on fear of furlough.
In your situation you would want classes full. Why? While we have a moderate rate of attrition above our seniority number the attrition is higher below. Then if classes are empty and no one to fill the FO seat, Mesa returns/stop receiving airplanes and you get downgraded.
We will be lucky to see a new contract in the next 2 years. It will not be industry leading or even average. And IT IS NOT BECAUSE THE CLASSES ARE FULL!!!
I suggest you do some reading on how a regional airline makes money. Also, read some articles about Mesa and what's happened in the last 11 years. Their failed ops in Hawaii and a few lost lawsuits along the way. If you're trying make Mesa better because you have no other airline to go to (DUI, Failures), then this forum isn't the place. If Mesa is your career then get involved with ALPA and learn more about the airline industry. Not just how to fly a jet and ***** about it on a forum.

Originally Posted by Duct Mon

You have got be one of the most clueless people on here. I as well as many others grow tired of your postings. I don't normally bash someone or someone's opinion but you are as ignorant as they come. Have you noticed that there aren't many that are agreeing with your posts?
You came here under the same conditions as any new hire today. In fact the new hires ARE getting more money than you did. Your comparisons about other regionals having similar pay back then is true to a certain degree. But, what you fail to mention is there were many more regionals with more pay and better contracts. You could have gone there. Maybe you were blinded by the "Shiny Jet Syndrome" or quick upgrade like any others that are on property. As far as what the new hires today are attracted to are the same as when you were hired. 1st year pay isn't even a consideration to most of these. Quick upgrade, new airplanes, growing company, domiciles, easy interview, good training Dept, less time on RSV, are still the top considerations.
I would like to go into detail about your argument regarding your claims of new hire classes empty equal higher pay in a new contract. I am going to simplify this for you because I have seen how difficult it is for you to understand labor and economics.
First off is what you fail to recognize are the reasons why new pilots are coming here. It isn't about 1st year pay.
Second, the Fee for Departure and contracts to which Mesa gets paid.
If you think that empty classrooms equals a new contract you are as simple as they come. Most recently you can see it didn't work for Republic. They couldn't fill classes, new contract, classes started to fill, rumor of bk, empty classes, loss of flying, pilots quitting on fear of furlough.
In your situation you would want classes full. Why? While we have a moderate rate of attrition above our seniority number the attrition is higher below. Then if classes are empty and no one to fill the FO seat, Mesa returns/stop receiving airplanes and you get downgraded.
We will be lucky to see a new contract in the next 2 years. It will not be industry leading or even average. And IT IS NOT BECAUSE THE CLASSES ARE FULL!!!
I suggest you do some reading on how a regional airline makes money. Also, read some articles about Mesa and what's happened in the last 11 years. Their failed ops in Hawaii and a few lost lawsuits along the way. If you're trying make Mesa better because you have no other airline to go to (DUI, Failures), then this forum isn't the place. If Mesa is your career then get involved with ALPA and learn more about the airline industry. Not just how to fly a jet and ***** about it on a forum.

Originally Posted by ScottyDo

That mentality is exactly why we don't have a better contract. And no Mesa is not my career. Clean record zero check ride failure and I have interviews at Frontier and Spirit next month so saying that I'm gonna be one of those lifers is pretty inaccurate. I'm just trying to leave behind something better than falling in bed with management because they gave you a quick upgrade. That is not longer the case so on top of no fast upgrade you get the industry's lowest pay, absolute zero reason to come here anymore. I don't feel like doing the math but say we have no more airplanes coming with slow to moderate attrition what would be the upgrade time honestly. It seems like people upgrade around the 650 to 700's in global senority and we are up to 1,300 pilots on property. So someone explain to me where that quick upgrade is? Lol

Also side note; are you saying I shouldn't voice my opinion simply because it differes from most of the company lovers who will bend over at the drop of a hat if JO asks them to?

Originally Posted by ScottyDo

That mentality is exactly why we don't have a better contract. And no Mesa is not my career. Clean record zero check ride failure and I have interviews at Frontier and Spirit next month so saying that I'm gonna be one of those lifers is pretty inaccurate. I'm just trying to leave behind something better than falling in bed with management because they gave you a quick upgrade. That is not longer the case so on top of no fast upgrade you get the industry's lowest pay, absolute zero reason to come here anymore. I don't feel like doing the math but say we have no more airplanes coming with slow to moderate attrition what would be the upgrade time honestly. It seems like people upgrade around the 650 to 700's in global senority and we are up to 1,300 pilots on property. So someone explain to me where that quick upgrade is? Lol

Also side note; are you saying I shouldn't voice my opinion simply because it differes from most of the company lovers who will bend over at the drop of a hat if JO asks them to?

Originally Posted by buffalopilot

So what is Mesa's plan to fill the CRJ Captain vacancies?

Originally Posted by Duct Mon

I am far from a company man. I've been here long enough to have my eyes wide open about Mesa and the Regional airline industry. Your opinion and argument is always the same and so inaccurate. Many posters on here have tried to school you but it's you that won't listen to others opinions. Unfortunately you just are so dense headed that you think it's as simple as you see it. And you don't listen or consider someone else's. Good luck with your interviews and Mesa will become a better place without you.

Originally Posted by ScottyDo

What have I said that is inaccurate? The fact that we are the lowest paid regional? With the worst hotels? Or the fact that upgrade times are no longer fast? Or is it the whole thing about less bodies coming in the door doesn't help the MEC. I mean if you think I am wrong somewhere on any of that by all means tell me since you obviously know wayyyyyyyyyyyy more than me.

Side note: anyone come up with a realistic upgrade time with no more additional airframs because with the about of FO's already on property it can by no means be "quick" any more.

Originally Posted by iFlyRC

With you leaving to a LCC right before you upgrade, I suspect a new hire today will still get off reserve, hold a line, and upgrade quicker at Mesa than most regionals. Everyone talks about projected upgrade time, Mesa has actual upgrades. Actual times?

Originally Posted by ScottyDo

Actual would be a good number to see but I'm talking about say someone hired today. And I haven't left yet, have to get hired first.