flapshalfspeed

^^^exactly

Sample calculation--let's say you came in with:

250 hrs multi-PIC
0 hours prior 121 SIC
0 hours 135(k) turbine PIC or military PIC

...then, you fly 1,000 hours SIC for Mesa.

Per the bare minimum updated FARs (121.436), you essentially just need your ATP + 1,000 hours SIC/PIC in 121 ops. Military turb PIC & 135(k) turbine PIC (>19 seats) counts towards your 1,000 hours.

However, per Mesa's CBA (as currently enforced by mgmt/union) you need 250 more hours PIC (or 500 more hours SIC).

I for one am overwhelmingly in favor of this requirement, and I think they should be way more restrictive (Mesa's reqs are less restrictive than any regional I am aware of). You have absolutely zero business being in command of an airliner with only 1,000 hours of 121 time and nothing else but 1,500 hours in a prop plane/CFIing. You haven't had your ass handed to you enough times, and you haven't had enough time to really, truly develop the instincts/self-knowledge required to be in that seat.

And honestly, if you think you're ready to be a Captain on an EJet/700/900 after 1 year of flying 121--with no other similar experience whatsoever--you're just going to hurt your career in the long-run. Taking command at that level of experience puts you at a much higher risk of accidents, incidents, and violations. How are you going to take the controls from a new hire FO when the plane slips over to the edge of the runway in a 35 knot xwind gust--with any authority--when you're basically still a new hire yourself? And have never landed in a 35 knot crosswind in a jet yourself?

Put a guy on reserve in PHX for 1-year (ppl are holding it out of new hire now), throw him in a left seat exactly 1,000 hours later, and he's done what? Maybe 1 landing on a contaminated runway? Maybe 3-5 approaches at the end of a max FDP in blowing snow at 1600 RVR at night? Maybe a handful of diversions/holds where he actually had to pay attention to his fuel status? How many go-arounds/real emergency situations has he ecountered? One? Zero?

I'm terrified of the current experience level at which Mesa allows people to upgrade--let's not go any lower.

FaceBiten

Yeah. That will bite a lot of unsuspecting quick upgrade types. Especially those, like me, with low multi time when hired. But if street captains are true, I see the company relaxing this requirement before they hire street captains.

ScottyDo

What do other regionals do in regards to this? Because I have no idea. I only ask because I am in the same boat. Hired with low multi time and right at the R-ATP mins of 1,000hrs total time.

Paid2fly

A very good guess too, I might add!

ScottyDo

A regional that wants a 1000 hours of PIC? Haha that's a good one.

FaceBiten

Name one regional who won't take anyone with atp mins only. Cpz maybe? Not even your skywest fantasy land is lucky enough to be able to have higher than atp mins as company mins. Off of your own recruiting webpage under r-atp reqts it says 25 hrs multi. No multi pic required. Every regional needs pilots...bad. Where do you think people are gonna get all this experience you seem to think is required to sit in the right seat of an RJ? Think the ATP reqts aren't strict enough with 1500 hours and needs to specify 500 hours of multi before someone is worthy of getting a min wage entry level 121 job? FAA apparently doesn't agree with your assessment. How bout those f16 pilots with almost no multi time. Guess they should go fly at GLA or amflight to be as good as commander FB and worthy of the right seat of a crj.

FaceBiten

I think you are missing the multi pic part, which is a Mesa reqt for upgrade.

FaceBiten

It's an arbitrary number people smarter than you came up with as an amount that is enough to probably gain some experience from, not really a joke...don't get your point. Still didn't answer the questions though. Good diversion.

How'd you build your time to get god status and bypass the low time unworthy of being in a regional status that everyone else has in your eyes? Why are you still a regional FO? Is your awesome regional canceling flights bc it can't fill the right seat? How is reserve at your regional. Oh yeah...

ScottyDo

Haha get this, so according to FaceBiter on another thread our IAH flying is "on thin ice". What the expert he is.

deltajuliet

Is that to say you need 500 total PIC, or 500 multi PIC?

And while we're on the topic, suppose a pilot comes in with a Restricted ATP right at 1000 hours. Somebody told me they need 1500 hours + the 1000 SIC to upgrade, essentially meaning they'd have to remain an FO until 2500 TT. However, reading the regs my interpretation is simply "1000 hours SIC" in a 121 environment, meaning they could hypothetically upgrade at 2000 hours TT. Could anyone shed light?