RV5M

Your reserve availability period is considered your FDP. People are confusing the little "FDP" they see in the Flica app as something it's not. If there's time left on your reserve availability period, even after a flight, they can call you. The 10 hours rest, etc. is for lineholders, which is defined in 117. Reserve pilots get their 10 hours after completing a reserve availability period which is, again, considered their FDP. Flica says FDP during and after a flight assigned to a reserve pilot because that's how the system works. It doesn't mean they're extending anything. Just something they have to put in there to make old technology work right.

This was also said in the ALPA call. They sounded a little surprised that anyone would even think they didn't have to answer their phone on reserve after completing a flight.

flapshalfspeed

That is a valid suggestion for the comms committee--e-mail them.

At my former company our ALPA conference calls were always recorded and uploaded as an mp3 to the union intranet site. I'm actually kind of surprised they don't at least transcribe all conference calls/meeting minutes--that's standard practice for every organizational meeting/conference I've been involved with since I was in junior high.

Perhaps there are some privacy issues I'm not aware of--like they don't want to create a record of comments by union officials/crewmembers calling in, in order to foster a more candid discussion of the issues?

Who knows--it does seem strange they don't record the conference calls.

Xdashdriver

FAR 117 does NOT consider a Reserve Availability Period to be part of the Flight Duty Period unless it is Airport/Standby Reserve. This is clearly stated in the regulations. However, to continue to use you after you have started flying for the day, they do have to keep the FDP clock running in between flights or possible flights in order to stay legal.

In the case they keep the clock running, they have to release you to a minimum 10 hour rest period once the max FDP from table B is reached, regardless of how much longer you have to go on your original RAP. Your RAP+FDP cannot exceed Table B plus 4 hours, nor exceed 16 hours total.

That is why they will put you on FDP status with an ending time that matches the max FDP from Table B. That may be different than your original RAP end time.

PiperPower

You are not on reserve after completing a flight. That is illegal.

There is nothing accurate about what you just wrote. FDP is not RAP. You're giving scheduling too much credit. This stuff happens at legacy carriers too. This isn't unique to regionals. In my opinion, we at the regional level are just populated with people who don't understand, and choose to not learn how this works. But frankly, you (the pilot) will be the one to get burned for doing something illegal. Not the scheduler.
Their sole job is to get flights covered. It makes zero difference to them if you do something illegal. The flight was covered, and there's a 99% chance the FAA will never know. Some of these schedulers are 19, 20, 21 years old. Not just at Mesa, but at majors too. They can be wrong. If you accept an illegal flight assignment, that's on you, not the scheduler. Frankly, they bank and RELY on people not understanding regs to get flights covered. Example; someone like you.
I just jumpseated into IAH today, sat up front, and talked with the UA pilots about this exact thing. This occurs there too, a lot. The difference is that they seem to understand their rights and call out scheduling when something isn't right.
It really irks me how you post your comments in such a matter of fact and certain way, and you're completely wrong. If you want to go work like that, go for it. But don't go and spew that crap around like its gospel. You're doing it wrong.

Considering how crappy this industry can be to us at times, this is something we can control, and should. I don't care who you are, this is your profession, and you should be smarter than the scheduler that's simply matching names with open flights on a computer. Give yourself some credit. Don't put your certs in the hands of some 21 year old scheduler that was hired 3 weeks ago.

*you are not on reserve just because you have FDP remaining. If that were the case, every pilot on their last day of a 4-day should sit on their ass at the airport waiting for their FDP to expire before commuting home. Regardless of being a line holder or a reserve pilot.
HOWEVER, if they call you and you answer the phone, and you have FDP remaining... Time to go back to work. So don't answer. You're not obligated to. Until you see a reserve shift on your schedule, you are off.

FaceBiten

This is from the alpa pdf on 117 rules giving the example that appears to be in dispute. Looks to me like if they reassign you prior to your trip ending, they can add what they want if it's within your FDP limits. But you can't block in, hit the train home, then get a call to go fly, without having an adequate rest period.

That said, after reading every single line of the 117 rules, this scenario is not exactly clear and specifically addressed, thus the dispute and conflicting guidance. The conference call answer JC I think gave doesn't jive with alpas publication.

Q-90. A flight crew member on reserve is assigned a 3-day trip. On day 3, the flightcrew member flies one segment and returns to base. After block-in, the certificate holder assigns 3 additional segments which can be completed within the FDP, flight time and cumulative limits. Is this permissible?
A-90. If the flightcrew member has completed the FDP (blocked in), he/she cannot be placed on a RAP to allow further flight assignments until he/she has received a 10 consecutive- hour rest. However, before the end of the FDP, the certificate holder could reschedule and add the 3 flight segments. In that event, the flightcrew member would have to recalculate the FDP, flight time and cumulative limits to determine if the additional flight segments can be legally flown. The flightcrew member would also have to reaffirm his or her fitness for duty before beginning each flight segment.

deltajuliet

While I've seen plenty of discrepancies and conflicting information on the matter, I think those letters of interpretation linked earlier are the most definitive answer on the matter (unfortunately).

Another topic the regs are ambiguous/unclear about is deadheading. You'd think that would have some limitation on it, but people say at the end of your trip you could hypothetically be put on a 100-hour deadhead back to base. Is that right?

Xdashdriver

Yup, but you have to be given compensatory rest equal to the length of the deadhead, so in this case, 100 hours of rest. That might make the company think twice about sending you around the world 4 times :-)

sulkair

So this is how they do it at F9. As quickly as you can, after you land, you have to call in to scheduling. If additional flying was put onto your schedule before you blocked in, then you have to go back out. Otherwise they have to immediately release you to your rest. Usually you get released.

My buddy just hired at Alaska (another Mesa guy) told me they do the same exact thing over there except instead of having to call them, you just have to be contactable for 15 minutes following block in, incase something was added prior to your block in.

Both of these procedures seem to back up Piper and Face's posts.

Xdashdriver

The ALPA 117 pdf says it is a November 2013 edition. Both interpretations linked to above have dates well into 2014. As a result there could be inaccurate answers in the ALPA document, which carries no legal weight. Interpretations, on the other hand, do carry legal weight as the FAA is allowed to interpret its own regulations.

iFlyRC

I don't want to de-rail the part 117 discussion, I just wanted to say how very cool it is being out here in Denmark for my captain upgrade. Haven't seen much of the country yet, as it is already night time here. The people are all very nice, very fit, and beautiful. My first time being in Europe, and just enjoying all of it. I feel pretty lucky getting to come here for this.
Back to part 117, this is all very interesting as I will go back to being on reserve when I am done. I have yet to experience part 117 from other than being a line holder.