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10-28-2008, 10:01 AM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 581
Sailingfun,
I disagree with your take on the various distributions regarding retirement. From my perspective, the senior guys, (who are PBGC PC category 3) received significantly more in total retirement benefits than the category 4 pilots.
You are correct that DALPA has been generous with pilots who have been furloughed, but not all junior pilots have been.
I did note that you did not refute my comments regarding the perfomance (or lack thereof) of the DALPA's MEC.
Let's agree to disagree.
I disagree with your take on the various distributions regarding retirement. From my perspective, the senior guys, (who are PBGC PC category 3) received significantly more in total retirement benefits than the category 4 pilots.
You are correct that DALPA has been generous with pilots who have been furloughed, but not all junior pilots have been.
I did note that you did not refute my comments regarding the perfomance (or lack thereof) of the DALPA's MEC.
Let's agree to disagree.
10-28-2008, 10:04 AM
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,324
I think the 2007/08 hires think it will be a "major hit" if they don't have 500 NWA pilots below them. It is shocking that anyone hired after 9/11 thinks they deserve more than DOH, especially the late 2007 and 2008 hires who know full well about the merger.
10-28-2008, 10:55 AM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: 737A
Posts: 1,890
10-28-2008, 01:13 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: Flying the SEC
Posts: 2,350
wasn't delta parking airplanes too. both called for cut backs this past spring.
what is furlough credit? years of service pay increase while on furlough. I've been told that most airline get that on the next contract following a furlough. Is that true?
nwa new hires will also be sharing the nwa retirements with delta pilots.
what is furlough credit? years of service pay increase while on furlough. I've been told that most airline get that on the next contract following a furlough. Is that true?
nwa new hires will also be sharing the nwa retirements with delta pilots.
Furlough credit (maybe the wrong term) is credit for pay purposes for time served while on furlough. Delta did that for their furloughees and the JPWA grants that to the NW guys also. So a 01 hire may have only worked 640 days, he will in the 7th year pay wise, a huge plus. Correct me if I am wrong but under the NW contract he is only payed for years of flying.
As for retirements, NW new hires will be sharing the Delta retirements too. They far outstrip the NW retirements if you look past 10 years. They also get access to over twice as many widebody cockpits as before.
10-28-2008, 01:36 PM
#56
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Pretty damned big one if they are sitting in the right seat of a (according to you... non premium widebody 767ER) and get bumped back to a DC9.
10-28-2008, 02:25 PM
#59
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 737 Capt
Posts: 1,166
No, they don't. They get furlough credit and a pay raise. Their relative seniority remains the same. But it is the NWA airplanes that are being retired in large numbers not the DAL ones. Absent the merger, the NW junior guys would be in the same jeopardy without the raises. Junior Delta guys would be in jeopardy too, but to a much smaller degree.
- Furlough credit and pay raises are not part of the SLI. These were addressed in the JPWA (different subject).
- Latest rumor is DAL reduction in flying and NWA bringing planes back. (Although to me this is not an issue as I feel we are all one company).
- Relative seniority does NOT remain the same under the DALPA plan, I personally lose right at 5% compared to my relative seniority at NWA. My seniority on the DAL proposal has me with guys that are almost 3 years junior to me.
- As for NWA guys being in jeopardy or not is a good question.... Maybe or maybe not, I feel a lot of the fleet planning is already being done with the merger in mind. So that said no merger might have made a difference in the airframes at NWA.
- As for furloughs, if the NWA pilots were subject to furlough with no merger they would have the NWA retirements to help bring them back. The furloughed DAL pilots would pretty much only have growth to help them.
10-28-2008, 02:41 PM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,002
Delta was parking RJs (50 seaters) and a few mainline planes that were up on hvy mx, nothing compared to the numbers of 9s that have been and are going to be retired.
Furlough credit (maybe the wrong term) is credit for pay purposes for time served while on furlough. Delta did that for their furloughees and the JPWA grants that to the NW guys also. So a 01 hire may have only worked 640 days, he will in the 7th year pay wise, a huge plus. Correct me if I am wrong but under the NW contract he is only payed for years of flying.
As for retirements, NW new hires will be sharing the Delta retirements too. They far outstrip the NW retirements if you look past 10 years. They also get access to over twice as many widebody cockpits as before.
Furlough credit (maybe the wrong term) is credit for pay purposes for time served while on furlough. Delta did that for their furloughees and the JPWA grants that to the NW guys also. So a 01 hire may have only worked 640 days, he will in the 7th year pay wise, a huge plus. Correct me if I am wrong but under the NW contract he is only payed for years of flying.
As for retirements, NW new hires will be sharing the Delta retirements too. They far outstrip the NW retirements if you look past 10 years. They also get access to over twice as many widebody cockpits as before.
I think the nwa furloughed pilots didn't get longevity but I've heard that most airlines take care of that at the next contract when it comes up. If that is true, then it would have happened and it just happened now rather than a little later because of the merger.
For new hires I would want the retirements now rather than later. I know the numbers are bigger down the road for delta but how do the %'s compare? Delta would have higher #'s because they are larger that's why I think the %'s are also important. Movement up the seniority will also bring higher pay and better quality of life.
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