Stupid Takeoff Briefs
10-24-2006, 04:28 PM
#34
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Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 6,009
S.A.L.T. Now that's an impressive brief from an airport surrounded by airports, or if you are above maximum landing weight... but what the heck does not apply to the small puddle CRJ or Jungle Jet drivers I guess or if you are flying MS flight simutator. I guess us 30 year plus experienced guys have been doing it all wrong. Oh well.
10-24-2006, 04:48 PM
#35
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Joined APC: Apr 2005
Position: 767ER capt
Posts: 1,190
captjns and jetjok- I'm with you. My experience has been that anyone who says "standard", has little or no idea as to what the standard procedure is. Actually briefing a plan has the benefit of reinforcing in your mind what you're going to do if red lights start coming on. It forces you to think, and it forces the other pilot to do the same.
Delta's brief has 6 major bullet points to cover. A complete brief takes, in most cases, less than a minute to spout off.
The brief needs to cover everything in the POM. Is it all necessary? Maybe not. Will the NTSB be looking for it on the tape? Bet on it. That's just the CYA argument for doing it, though.
Delta's brief has 6 major bullet points to cover. A complete brief takes, in most cases, less than a minute to spout off.
The brief needs to cover everything in the POM. Is it all necessary? Maybe not. Will the NTSB be looking for it on the tape? Bet on it. That's just the CYA argument for doing it, though.
10-24-2006, 08:49 PM
#36
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Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Retired
Posts: 3,717
I find it of interest that, after going back and reviewing all the posts in this thread, that the vast majority of folks dissing the required before-takeoff brief are either First Officers or they don't list their crew position, or are not even pilots. For you non-captains, just remember, you'll be there some day, and then it will be your turn to be both in-charge as well as responsible for the safe operation of your aircraft. Then we'll see how your attitude will change. In the meantime, suck it up, pay attention, and learn from the guys in the left seat. They're there, because they got there first and usually they have been there and done that. If they believe in spending their time to provide the crew with good (and legal) briefing, the least you can do is listen and not ***** about it.
10-25-2006, 04:00 AM
#37
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Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: B-777 Captain
Posts: 943
Totally agree with the other Jetjok. When its your turn in the left seat do it your way. But I'll bet you do the company's way with a fed or check airmen on board...........
Over a cup of coffee in the middle of the night a fellow MD-11 Captain friend of mine was relating a discussion he had with his co-pilot who was stating he should be paid the same as a Captain because he pushed the same buttons. To which my friend calmly explained .... son you may push the same buttons as I do, but you don't do what I do... Enough said.
Over a cup of coffee in the middle of the night a fellow MD-11 Captain friend of mine was relating a discussion he had with his co-pilot who was stating he should be paid the same as a Captain because he pushed the same buttons. To which my friend calmly explained .... son you may push the same buttons as I do, but you don't do what I do... Enough said.
Last edited by JetJocF14; 10-25-2006 at 04:07 AM.
10-25-2006, 04:21 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: FO - 757/767
Posts: 1,228
captjns and jetjok- I'm with you. My experience has been that anyone who says "standard", has little or no idea as to what the standard procedure is. Actually briefing a plan has the benefit of reinforcing in your mind what you're going to do if red lights start coming on. It forces you to think, and it forces the other pilot to do the same.
Delta's brief has 6 major bullet points to cover. A complete brief takes, in most cases, less than a minute to spout off.
The brief needs to cover everything in the POM. Is it all necessary? Maybe not. Will the NTSB be looking for it on the tape? Bet on it. That's just the CYA argument for doing it, though.
Delta's brief has 6 major bullet points to cover. A complete brief takes, in most cases, less than a minute to spout off.
The brief needs to cover everything in the POM. Is it all necessary? Maybe not. Will the NTSB be looking for it on the tape? Bet on it. That's just the CYA argument for doing it, though.
10-25-2006, 04:22 AM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: FO - 757/767
Posts: 1,228
I find it of interest that, after going back and reviewing all the posts in this thread, that the vast majority of folks dissing the required before-takeoff brief are either First Officers or they don't list their crew position, or are not even pilots. For you non-captains, just remember, you'll be there some day, and then it will be your turn to be both in-charge as well as responsible for the safe operation of your aircraft. Then we'll see how your attitude will change. In the meantime, suck it up, pay attention, and learn from the guys in the left seat. They're there, because they got there first and usually they have been there and done that. If they believe in spending their time to provide the crew with good (and legal) briefing, the least you can do is listen and not ***** about it.
10-25-2006, 04:44 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 6,009
As Jetjok pointed said... showed your hand who posts a good game, but in the end of the day, if you are a crewdog, I can't see that you have the where with all to step up to the plate and tell you capt. "Hey lets do it as prescribed in our GOM, and POM". That's OK... I guess, but not on my crew. That't the attitude that separates true crewmembers with good CRM and performance skills with those who just plain don't belong in the cockpit.
After you are with a commuter for at least a month or two you'll get the picture.
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