tomgoodman

That's true. Unions have the same chance in bankruptcy court as Christians did in the Coliseum.

DAL 88 Driver

Not to get too religious here. But it is Easter Sunday... so I gotta point out that at least the Christians wouldn't give up their faith.

Elvis90

The early Christians had stronger 'union' leadership.

TheManager

Slow, I understand the process favors management. However, I would not take the defeatist approach and proclaim that it "was stacked heavily in favor of management."

With creative legal minds and strategic thinking, one can protect their interests more effectively than DALPA did in the 1113 process.

For instance, why was there not any iron clad snap back provision that was fair to both parties negotiated anywhere in the process?

Basically, why did we agree to an open ended emergency loan that is now obviously not needed?

Why would ALPA legal craft a BPL that must have had so many holes in it that the company felt that they could unilaterally throw it out with impunity during the 1113 process. Really! It is a bankruptcy protection letter......designed to protect during the 1113, right? Why wasn't this letter designed to work without resulting to a group of arbitrators to decide on it.

Obviously, it wasn't properly pressure tested to see where it needed to be reinforced. Kind of like another aggreement we have with the company that has plenty of leaks in it.

Basically, either ALPA's legal help was over matched, or, they only put in a half hearted attempt without stretching themselves. Mind you, they all knew that they where going toe to toe with some of the best BK and contract lawyers in the United States, employed by Delta and the creditors of course.

I'm gonna guess they were way over matched. So, why would we continue to employ them and seek their professional "services?" Don't mischaracterize this post though. I am not advocating for or against DALPA/ALPA or DPA. I am advocating for obtaining the best, most competent legal help available when needed. Going back to the same well is not working.



Happy Easter especially to all of you on the road and missing their families.
Wish you were getting time and a half like our FA's and our SWA bros.

TheManager

http://www.dp3.org/data/05.1212%20In...0Agreement.pdf

Hey, Slow. Couldn't find a copy of the BPL. Do not think anyone in the membership has seen it actually. Can you or Alpha dig it up out of your archives in the office?

Or, do the financial numbers and triggers still make it super confidential despite the fact that we are years seperated from the 1113?

tomgoodman

Very true, but we have to play the hand we're dealt. Under similar circumstances, our best option would be to bribe Caesar.

slowplay

It's not a defeatist approach. It is fact. The process is stacked in favor of the debtor (bankrupt company management).

You assert that "with creative legal minds and strategic thinking, one can protect their interests more effectively than DALPA did in the 1113 process." Please show me a similarly situated union that did better in the bankruptcy process than DALPA.

Why weren't there snapbacks? Because they weren't achieved in negotiation. The "demand committee" didn't have the leverage to get them.

As to it being an open ended emergency loan, that's one of the Cabot kid's favorite expressions. You guys reading each other's stuff on another site?

We've been out of bankruptcy since May 3, 2007. Profit sharing paid twice, and pilots got 5.6% of the new Delta with the merger. In between the company lost billions, and analysts are predicting $0.50 per share loss for Tuesday. Our "record" year was a 4.7% margin, not really a record at all. Our PWA makes us the overall second highest cost pilots in the passenger industry (behind LUV). Those are facts. It's also a fact we're not paid enough. If LUV management can afford to pay their current rates, DAL management has a responsibility to their shareowners to develop a sustainable business plan return that can pay at least those kind of rates as well. To not do so would be bad for business, imo.

TheManager

And yes, it was a real bankruptcy and it was a real BK court and it also was the same 1113 process.

slowplay

I thought it was a part of LOA-46 and was put in front of the membership. I don't think there was anything confidential about it.

slowplay

Not exactly. Hawaiian creditors got paid 100 cents on the dollar... DAL, not so much.

It was a sham related to their ownership structure.