80ktsClamp

ACL- we've talked about this a few times, but let me post this on the public side here:

You say ALPA national can be fixed. One question: How? Getting rid of Prater won't fix it, so what can we actually do?

We all know the way the unionoids on this site greet contention. We're the forum hellraisers, we don't represent the majority. Which that is a supremely ignorant point of view (yes, talking about you alfa). The majority of guys I fly with are MORE militant, just less vocal.

Carl Spackler

Sheeesh!

Carl

Carl Spackler

That's the same for me Clamp.

Carl

Carl Spackler

Latest revision to the DPA cliche list:

alfaromeo:

2..Temper tantrums
1..Pitchforks and torches in hand

sink r8:

3..Eating ourselves like the USAPA
2..Slitting our wrists
1..Contractual suicide

acl65pilot:

14.Fix ALPA from within
13.Let's keep our seat at the table
12.Can you guarantee this will work?
11.Throwing grenades in the room
10.Throwing out the baby with the bath water
9.. Selling out ALPA
8.. Blindly voting
7.. Voting in anger
6.. Unintended consequences!
5.. Throwing your arms up in defeat
4.. Cutting bait and running
3.. The nuclear option
2.. Mutually assured destruction
1.. ALPA is working "behind the scenes"

iceman49

80, I would agree...it is a very fine line, however we must not forget that it works only when management wants to play ball. The USAir deal was killed because mgmt wanted it killed...not because of the pilots, they wanted us to think we did. The NWADL happened because mgmt wanted it to happen, we were sold on the idea by them, where did the money come from that wasn't there before? Its a very fine line.

acl65pilot

I think that I have stated many of them in 86 or so pages.

Electoral College type of President and officer election. With reps being the only ones that can recall/impeach.

Similar to the funding bills for the US budget after a set amount for Group A and B groups, the BOD or senate if you, will have to vote for funding approval. Lets say what their dues dollars bring in a year for a baseline but debatable. Threshold is different for each group or make it based upon total dues dollars contributed.

Have the pilots of the compensation committee this week change the way the officers are paid. Call your reps.

Make it the highest paid group or average of top three with no override.
Car, housing allowances should be for equal value of house car etc of the locality where the pilot lives. It is more expensive to live in DC. Many of you state that this is their choice, but no one is going to move their family to DC for a short term job, so similar housing and allowances. If that is still not acceptable to the rank and file, then ALPA buys houses for the Leaders and they are held in ALPA's name not theirs. Same for cars, etc.

No more than 150% reimbursement per locality for expenses on ALPA business.

Make votes dependent on percentage of dues dollars, or use another type of Congress sort of weighting. Weight each airlines votes based upon percentage of dues dollars and pilots. We are close to that now. We contribute about 25% of ALPA's dues dollars and get about 25% of the roll call votes so this is a little more than window dressing.


Add your solutions or suggestions to this.

My question you is, How would DPA be different? I look at what the independents do, and it smells very similar but without the influence.

gloopy

Maybe, but FA's don't have nearly the scope issues pilots do as they as a group (by and large) tend to ride the coat tails of whatever the pilots pay to negotiate for. It makes far less sense for FA's to unionize than it does for pilots. DL has done a pretty good job, consistently over the decades, to provide non union FA's with pay, benefits and job security (individual and group) than any alphabet group FA union has, other than at SWA due to the phenominal success of that company especially during their last contract. But their gains are not a union thing by any means. Yet some FA's think a union yes vote will equal SWA pay rates and everything else being the same for a big win. Not going to happen and when it doesn't, the infighting will start. All the while, they will get whatever scope the pilots pay for for free and by default.

iceman49

By that reasoning, the pilots do not need a union.

JABDIP

Clamp,
I gotta say that the majority of guys I fly with are not happy with ALPA including myself. Whether that transpires into a vote for DPA, who knows??? But to dismiss this(ALPA discontent) is a serious mistake.

FlyingViking

Have you (or anyone else) ever flown with anybody who is happy with ALPA? Other than the guys who works for them I sure haven't...