DAL 88 Driver

Another urban legend. Anyone who is dissatisfied with DALPA is just a "malcontent" who is going to complain about anything. Sorry, T, but that argument just doesn't fly. There are valid complaints about DALPA... not the least of which is that they have no stated objective and most of their communications look like they were written by the company's negotiators.

OccupyRestSeat

It has nothing to do with "quicker."

But ALPA thanks you for tossing in a red herring.

I think the ALPA waterboys have a new alias.

tsquare

Well then... let's get into it.. what is your minimum opening that will make you back DALPA again? We'll keep it down to two items.. scope and pay for the -88. Take your time.

If you have read my posts on the subject, you know absolutely what it will take for me to be interested in DPA.. yet all I hear is crickets...

tsquare

Please read my last post to 88driver. If you can answer it, I will retract my statement about your inability to see anything positive in DALPA.

And since you are apparently new here, you may not know that I have thrown my fair share of grenades at DALPA too... ergo no waterboy... take your time.

OccupyRestSeat

I'll listen to DALPA if they pledge to never again accept FPL from the company, or waste our dues money on cushy boondoggles--and disclose how they spend every cent of our dues money. Oh, and agree to never send another cent to national....ever.

Until then, I'm not interested.

DAL 88 Driver

Probably not any quicker. What we're trying to avoid (or at least I'm trying to avoid) is an agreement that settles for a very small pay increase and little to no improvement to scope. We took a 42% pay cut and have had little more than an inflation adjustment to our bankruptcy/emergency pay. And we continue to lose jobs to RJ's, JV's, code shares, etc.

ALPA crows all the time about how "significant" and "substantial" these gains during the merger were, because they did something "no one else has ever done." Well I'm not interested in novelties. I'm interested in results. And ALPA seems more interested in charting new waters. All the communications ALPA has sent us point to low expectations for this next contract. I have zero confidence that ALPA is going to get anything that significantly closes the gap on restoration or even SWA pay. I'm just not willing to take any more chances on them.

DPA is certainly not a sure thing. But I see ALPA as being a sure thing... a sure thing that I want no part of.

IADBLRJ41

What part of a multi year journey through bargaining is good for your pilot group. I am far from an ALPA waterboy but was curious to how you feel your pilot group will gain in this next section 6.

OccupyRestSeat

Of course I see some positive things in DALPA. I think there are a ton of hard-working volunteers on various committees who are doing great stuff to help you and I. I am very grateful for their service. Guys will do the same, whether ALPA or DPA is our agent.

My issue is with the compensated DALPA folks who get a free trip to Herndon, get wined and dined (on our dime), baptized into the system. Do you know what those guys are briefed on, what they're promised (and what they promise in return) and how much they stand to lose if they get bounced? That's in addition to the "special" relationship they have with the company.

Jack Bauer

What I wrote was an example of what has been floated by pro DPA guys including myself. I have no idea what the actual DPA would propose although I do know they are big on the notion the pilots wants/interests can be accurately represented as opposed to the DALPA "we know whats best, we will handle this privately between us and management" way.

For me personally, I would take SWA plus 5% DOS plus 5% each year after that for 3 years (I dont think this would sound outlandish to the mediators especially given the fact Delta is on track to be making some significant money (billions including the paydown money) in the near term during one of the worst years (fuel/economy/earthquakes/etc) in aviation history and even more money going forward in the coming years.

When I say SWA, I mean their 737 rates equal our MD rates. Based upon those ratios all the other equipment rates climb respectfully. That would put a 12 year MD captain at $220.50/hr and a five year MD FO at 132.30/hr at DOS. That's a roughly 39.5% increase on the Captain side and would put the largest equipment captain rate in the neighborhood of $302.71/hr. Not full restoration plus inflation but by linking to the SWA payrates in a meaningful way it gets us much closer to our goal. On the contract survey I put 40% initial pay increase. This proposal meets that criteria.

My fear is that ALPA will come back with something in the neighborhood of +7 at DOS plus 4% each year after that for 4 or five years or maybe even worse! In recent years ALPA has tended to see most things through managements glasses and are more than willing to "help a management friend" out. It's getting really old.

What would you propose?

DAL 88 Driver

We've been "into it." I've stated my minimum opening before. But since you've apparently forgotten, here's a review:

Pay - 2004 (pre-paycut) rates + COLA for an opener. Or some combination of rates and work rules that results in a comparable W2 to 2004 + COLA. I would consider voting YES to an agreement that gets us SWA W2's +. As a review, that would be over $230K for a domestic narrowbody Captain and over $140k for a domestic narrowbody F/O.

Scope - Do not renew the DCI agreements as they expire. All flying of Delta passengers in aircraft painted with the Delta logo and in Delta colors must be done by Delta seniority list pilots. I would accept as a minimum all aircraft (jet or turboprop) with greater than 50 seats must be flown by Delta seniority list pilots.

Both of these items are crucial in order to get a YES vote from me.

As far as what it would take for you to support DPA. Why don't you email TC and ask him for your "no SLI dispute promise" letter? I have no doubt he would be willing to answer that question to your satisfaction. And if you're not willing to take this step after everything you've written about that issue... well, I don't have a lot of sympathy for your concern. Let us know what you find out.